Inside Family Law with Zoë Durand

"the wider family law umbrella" why Rafton's sponsor at Pacifica Congress, Cairns, 2024 Sponsoring coffee cart at Pacifica Congress. RAMP - Rafton's Arbitration and Mediation Practice Maurice Edwards, and his role at RAMP sponsorship and importance of interdisiplinary conferences with input from social scientists and psychologists and all those in the wider family law umbrella. History of Rafton's and Kate's legal career. offices - Hawkesbury, Penrith, Glenmore Park, Macarthur office, Sydney, Parramatta office. Balmain - care and protection. Discussion of arbitration. Why is there reluctance to recommend Arbitration? Some practitioners may have a lack of confidence re the process. Maurice Edwards Kate's interest in the coverage of blended families at the conference. Difference parenting styles, attachment issues. Time arrangements.   https://rafton.com.au/ https://pacificacongress.org/    

Dr Leo Schep Analysing hair, urine and blood tests. You can usually tell if someone is using medical marujiana or if there is recreational use based on the results. Timelines for how long tests can work - urine, blood vs hair follicle tests AND also depends on the type of the drug (this is a must listen to). "What implication does that have on the impairment of the individual?" If someone uses a drug once does it show up in the test? May be a small blip on the test. You cannot correlate back to a dose, but some studies can bracket results in low, medium, high. Leo says you can get an estimate of drug use in a test. CDT testing (alcohol use). Benefits and negatives of various tests - hair, blood, urine. Understanding what each test offers. What should lawyers include in the instructions to a toxicologist. "We can form a conclusion with caveats" from drug testing. What killed Alexander The Great? (Interesting discussion). Illustrating the importance of cross disciplinary discussions.  www.pacificacongress.org  https://www.toxinform.com

"Coming home" with Dr Phil Watts at  the Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024, on value of Pacifica Congress Conference, cross examination and norms in psychological tests Burn out. People are overloaded. Due to a lack of appreciation. Most people are not appreciative of what we do. Importance of support network. Brintyn shared his experience of what did and did not work. We do work in a risk zone. What can we do to manage risk. When cross examining an expert, key part is psychological tests are normed on a group of people. Westernised, English speaking people. Test may be of low validity if they have little connection with Anglo Australian background. Ask who was the test normed on? Looking at the presupposition of why the test was administered. Value of Pacifica Congress conference. "A bit like coming home." Where 100% of the content was relevant. 

"Tell me more", Dr Phil Stahl on report writing at Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024   Phil Stahl on report writing and helping report writers to develop a method for how they write reports. Looking at the strengths and weaknesses of the report. What are the common issues with reports? Across the board one of the issues is a lack of depth. For example ask the parent why they are concerned. Why they believe certain things. What they know about their children's needs and how to meet those needs.  Sometimes reports don't tie the connection between the issues they are evaluating and parenting and co parenting.  Also some reports do not have a forensic mindset. We need to question more. Ask "Tell me more" or "help me understand". Need to have risk benefit analysis of different parenting plans. Making recommendations. Also toxicity in working in family law space. What can help address the toxicity? More peacefulness, more collaborative approaches. Rather than a system of blame instead move to problem solving and being future focused. "What do you think your child needs when all of us are out of your life?" Get the parents in the mindset of problem solving. Rather than have them "be right" have them do right. Each individual has a role to play in solving the problems. Peacefulness. Can we lover the temperature. Move from this to this. 

"The Outcomes for Families" - Amanda Little at Pacifica Congress, Cairns, 2024 The value of interdisciplinary conferences. We are constantly "Calling on all the other knowledge" . The value in family law of understanding other areas. Interdisciplinary referrals. Collaboratively working with each other. Family Law Education Network is also finding that other professionals have jointed FLENA. Family law professionals.  History of FLENA. Precedents services that FLENA offers. Also discussion of AI.   www.pacificacongress.org https://familylawedu.com.au/

The Hon Steven Strickland KC, Justice Tom Altobelli AM, Stephen Foley, Dr Simon Kennedy, Nadine Udorovic, Dr Peter Krabamn, Clare Rowe and Leigh McBean.

“bite the bullet” proposed changes to the Family Law Act, The Hon Steven Strickland KC, Pacifica Congress Cairns Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   The Honourable Steven Strickland KC Exposure draft. Proposed amendments to Family Law Act. Proposed provisions that would allow the Court to consider family violence in property matters. The proposed amendments would be beyond the scope of Kennon.  Issues and benefits of such amendments. This may create the need for lengthy affidavits and delays. The Hon Steven Strickland’s views about if such amendments should come into force. His view is it has to be brought in “it is necessary, but the issue is how it is done. There may only be one way to do it – just bite the bullet and you have to have to your fight in court.” Flow on effects into settlement negotiations and mediation. (Mediating in the shadow of the law, but there is no jurisprudence on this probably for some time). Cross fertilization at Pacifica Congress conferences “it’s different.” To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ https://stevenstricklandkc.au/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

“What’s gone wrong?”, dangers of too much screen time for children in a post covid world, Simon Kennedy, Pacifica Congress Cairns Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Simon Kennedy Covid and changes to children’s lifestyles. Issue of if there is over diagnosis of ASD. In Dr Kennedy’s perspective there is a current over diagnosis of ASD and ADHD, in particular since covid. Why aren’t my kids functioning properly? Issue of screen time with children and anxiety. Children being over exposed to things that are not positive for their mental health. “Parents take their children to a psychologist or a neurologist and ask ‘what’s gone wrong’ and they will say ‘you clearly have ASD or ADHD.’” 10 years ago we did not have children on screens to this extent. Not enough physical activity. Issue of assessors not looking at context around things. Too much time on screens replacing normal activities. Don’t go searching for unusual diagnosis if there has been a problem since the child was very young. We need to get back to “what makes kid tick.” Parents need to be in charge. Issue with the over use of screens. Also issue around the content of what children are watching. Problems with children learning about sexuality via pornography as opposed to organically, gradually and within a relational way. Strangulation in porn. “It’s entirely reasonable for parents to coordinate their children’s lives… rather than put them in front of a screen and hope for the best.” To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ https://www.psychologycamberwell.com/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

“We take the burden off” Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Leigh McBean Sponsorship of conference. How the funding process works. Inability to pay legal fees creating pressure for clients and lawyers and also affecting the dynamic between lawyers and clients. Demographics of who uses JustFund. Interim applications re release of funds VS legal lending. Nitty gritty of legal lending, for example approval, updates and interest etc. Issues re other forms of lending i.e. redraw on home loan, credit cards. To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ https://justfund.com.au/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

“the flippant way” Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Clare Rowe The issues with accessibility of psychological terms in the mainstream and in particular social media. I.e Tik tok or Instagram diagnosis or narcissism, or BPD. Difficulty of seeing the other party through the lense of personality disorders and the sense that it then means the matter cannot resolve or progress. Information on the Family Report Writers Network. https://www.roweandassociates.com.au https://www.familyreportwriters.com.au/ To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

“Just keep asking the questions” Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Stephen Foley, Legal Ready E-brief ready – electronic briefs. Covid and how this affected the uptake of technology. Uptake of AI in products. AI plus lawyer as a good combination at the moment. Use AI wisely. “Don’t put your head in the sand” but “start touching the keys.” Start becoming familiar with AI in law. Chat GPT. Value of face to face conferences. Trust that is built in person. Where are we heading in the future with AI and technology in law? Reid Hoffman and his twin (having an AI conversation with his twin). “Just keep asking the questions. What does this mean for us and where do we want to go?” Zoe asks “it is confronting because it makes us ask where is the core of the human? Where does consciousness exist?” Discussion of Stephen Hawking's predictions re dangers of AI. Chat GPT. The movie “Her” from years ago has arrived. Is AI sentient? The AI companion. I, robot film. Should there be better governance of AI and general intelligence. As a society we should be talking about what should regulation and laws around AI be.   To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ Connect with Stephen at https://www.legalready.ai/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

“Other ways”, Nadine Udorovic, Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Why sponsor Pacifica Congress? Nicholes Family Lawyers has been sponsoring for years. Importance of interdisciplinary conferences and also the formal and informal aspects of such conferences. Approach of the firm to look at other ways to resolve a dispute. Amazing opportunity to meet with the professionals who work at the coalface in family law. Understanding how psychologists approach reports. How this connects into what lawyers do ie subpoenas, how affidavits are drafted. Upcoming events for Nicholes Family Lawyers. World Congress. Podcast series launched by Nadine Udorovic “Family Law: our reality”. Upcoming celebrities include “Jen and Ben.” Comments on blended families and other family structures by Justice Altobelli. Forced to go back to the original questions around what we do. “It opens your mind and it broadens your thinking.” (Nadine). To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ Connect with Nadine at https://nicholeslaw.com.au/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

Dr Peter Krabman “People who struggle to adapt to life”. The University of Wollongong AIR program. (Affect, Identity and Relationship). Struggle with identities. People owning and working to address personality disorder. Stigma around personality disorders. Value of DBT Therapy. Instagram or social media “diagnosis”. Can a person “recover” from a personality disorder?  Difficulty with diagnosis when these issues are on a continuum. Challenges parents face with school. Personality disordered parents at school. Practical tips for lawyers on how to work with clients who have a personality disorder. Reach Dr Krabman at https://drpeterkrabman.com/ To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

Inside Family Podcast: Pacifica Congress Cairns 2024 series   Justice Tom Altobelli AM How families have changed and may change in the future. Also the use of AI and emerging technology in family law in the future: benefits and potential problems. To join Pacifica Congress or attend their next event see https://pacificacongress.org/ @INSIDE FAMILY LAW SPOTIFY OR PODBEAN https://zoedurand.podbean.com/ www.mediationanswers.com.au

As featured in The Australian 23 April 2019 https://www.theaustralian.com.au/inquirer/family-law-reform-priority-for-next-australian-government/news-story/93af28df3bbe0c6f67b1e69910c7a0a2 https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/judicial-wishlist-to-clear-family-law-backlog/news-story/68f15f036d7d47fbb5b5a1f6629cd418 In this interview I speak with former Family Court Judge, The Honourable Peter Rose AM QC (now Mediator, Arbitrator and Adjunct Professor at Sydney University and also my mentor for several years) about the ‘the good, the bad and the ugly’ (my words) in relation to the recommendations for family law reform in the ALRC report.  For more on the Inside Family Law book see www.mediationanswers.com.au    

“huge beast” – Clare Rowe on NDIS & parents disputes about diagnosis of children at the Pacifica Congress conference Listen in https://www.podbean.com/eas/pb-ujz8a-14d6128   Clare Rowe https://www.roweandassociates.com.au/ Clare has presented at Pacifica Congress events several times including at their Plus One event in Sydney 2023. Clare, through the Family Report Writer’s Network is sponsoring the Inside Family Law Podcast Champagne Celebration.   At the Pacifica Congress Conference live in Hobart 2023 www.pacificacongress.org   The Inside Family Law Podcast is hosted by Zoe Durand at Mediation Answers www.mediationanswers.com.au in partnership with Lawyer Magic and ArtWork.   If you would like to attend the champagne celebration on 1 November 2023 for the Inside Family Law and network with our remarkable guests that we have hosted over the years secure your spot at: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/736405357247?aff=oddtdtcreator   “10% of 5 to 7 year old boys are on the NDIS” No actual test as such for autism or ADHD. It is the professional opinion for such a diagnosis, but 2 different professionals could have different views. Funding is tied to diagnosis. What are the implications of a diagnosis of say autism? Pressure on psychologists to diagnose given otherwise parents lose their funding, which could negatively impact family. Autism 1, 2, 3 (only 2 and 3 receive funding). Clare has not yet seen a diagnosis of autism 1, because there is no funding for this. Dynamic between what we diagnose and funding. Dynamic where parents polarise. I.e one prefers nachos and video games and the other prefers vegan lifestyle. They become more extreme once separated. Then party A says the child isn’t eating healthy food in party B’s home and Party B says the child is not being fed properly on an overly restrictive diet. When together they balance each other. Once apart “they become more them”. This is understandable to an extent as when people separate they go out to find themselves. Clare’s involvement in matters where one party asserts a diagnosis and the other disputes it. Different outcomes in those matters. In one case mother had Munchhausen’s by proxy and was unwell and in others the child should have been diagnosed and the other parent disputing it was asked to be involved and learn about the child’s needs etc. Sometimes the reason a parent disputes a diagnosis is because they were not involved in that diagnosis in the first place and once they are involved they can engage with recommendations. Is there sometimes a tendency to pathologize human variance?

“out of your comfort zone” – Fiona Kirkman on technology and AI in family law at the Pacifica Congress conference Fiona Kirkman from FamilyProperty (https://www.familyproperty.com.au/team). FamilyProperty were sponsors of the Pacifica Congress conference in Hobart 2023. They are also sponsoring the Inside Family Law Champagne Celebration. At the Pacifica Congress Conference live in Hobart 2023 www.pacificacongress.org   The Inside Family Law Podcast is hosted by Zoe Durand at Mediation Answers www.mediationanswers.com.au in partnership with Lawyer Magic and ArtWork.   If you would like to attend the champagne celebration on 1 November 2023 for the Inside Family Law and network with our remarkable guests that we have hosted over the years secure your spot at: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/736405357247?aff=oddtdtcreator   Technology can be used to smooth over the pain points in our work. We will discuss “how can technology help with automating some of the repetitious manual work to make things more efficient.” Some parts of the process that technology can assist in include: Intakes and initial client information i.e gathering of information Balance sheet Disclosure “Get out of your comfort zone and try it.” At first it takes time to learn how to use technology, but once you use it, it is difficult to go back to pen and paper. Important for retention, in particular of younger lawyers in firms to use technology to make work more efficient. AI can be useful in family law, however be aware of example when AI hallucinated cases. A Clients are aware of AI and use chat GP. Chat GP comes up in matters in family law matters. AI will not replace lawyers, but technology can be used to replace parts of our work that are repetitious.

“hidden in plain sight” – Nicola Taylor and Marilyn Freeman on a paradigm shift and new frontiers in what is part of family law at the Pacifica Congress conference Nicola Taylor https://www.otago.ac.nz/cic/staff/professor-nicola-taylor Dr Marilyn Freeman https://www.westminster.ac.uk/about-us/our-people/directory/freeman-marilyn At the Pacifica Congress Conference live in Hobart 2023 www.pacificacongress.org   The Inside Family Law Podcast is hosted by Zoe Durand at Mediation Answers www.mediationanswers.com.au in partnership with Lawyer Magic and ArtWork.   If you would like to attend the champagne celebration on 1 November 2023 for the Inside Family Law and network with our remarkable guests that we have hosted over the years secure your spot at: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/736405357247?aff=oddtdtcreator   “There are a whole lot of transitions and experiences that children and young people have.” Gender dysphoria, child soldiers, children sports people. Opening up the space for what is family law to include issues for young people around identity and its formation and its disruption. “Identity formation is critical to the way we think about children. “Identity formation is one of the key aspects of childhood development.” Nicola. Overall it was received positively at the conference (expanding the understanding of family law). Paradigm shift to look at what are children’s experiences “hidden in plain sight”. An attendee said “I’m going to do my work differently” (Marilyn). Donor children, care and protection work, asylum seeking children. A different paradigm rather than entering through adults experiences (i.e what happens to an adult, ie marriage, separation, divorce) but instead what are the experiences children move through (Zoe). Youth Law Australia.

“a different approach” – Phil Stahl on the value of interdisciplinary discussions at the Pacifica Congress conference Phil Stahl (https://parentingafterdivorce.com/) At the Pacifica Congress Conference live in Hobart 2023 www.pacificacongress.org   The Inside Family Law Podcast is hosted by Zoe Durand at Mediation Answers www.mediationanswers.com.au in partnership with Lawyer Magic and ArtWork.   If you would like to attend the champagne celebration on 1 November 2023 for the Inside Family Law and network with our remarkable guests that we have hosted over the years secure your spot at: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/736405357247?aff=oddtdtcreator   Discussion on Dr Phil Stahl’s take aways from the Pacifica Congress Conference in Hobart 2023. Why Dr Phil Stahl is a part of the Pacifica Congress Conference. Supercharged testimony talk at the conference. Differences in the approach in the USA. Tips to improve the quality of reports and assessments. Discussion of coercive control at Pacifica Congress 2023 History of Pacifica Congress and predecessor AFCC. Learning from others who are not in psychology ie lawyers and Judges. Bringing together leaders in the field. Importance of lunchtime chats and informal discussions. Interdisciplinary work in family law and psychology in shades of grey, “but the law tends to be black and white.” “we can all learn from each other. We all work with children.” Connections made through Pacifica are important, they become like family. When we step back… we can then take a different approach to things.”

“our client is the child” – Olia Pelayo from Children in Focus on the supervision process and keeping children in the centre of it at the Pacifica Congress Conference series. Olia Pelayo (https://www.childreninfocus.com.au) At the Pacifica Congress Conference live in Hobart 2023 www.pacificacongress.org   The Inside Family Law Podcast is hosted by Zoe Durand at Mediation Answers www.mediationanswers.com.au in partnership with Lawyer Magic and ArtWork.   If you would like to attend the champagne celebration on 1 November 2023 for the Inside Family Law and network with our remarkable guests that we have hosted over the years secure your spot at: https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/736405357247?aff=oddtdtcreator   Process, applications, forms etc and timeline (usually about 1 week from applying to be able to supervise). Locations that Children in Focus can attend How the role is explained to children. “Meet and greet” with children. Concerns of clients about supervision and Olia’s responses. Children in Focus work with the family as to what the children have been told about their role. Sometimes the children are fearful to see their parent and the children are fine to refer to them as the supervisor. In the meet and greet they explain the process, what will happen and if any safety words etc needed. “keeping the children safe basically” is the role of the supervisor. When the supervisor will intervene. I.e. immediate if child is hit etc. If there is a negative comment made, then supervisor may intervene and ask the parent to stop this behaviour. If behaviour continues then they may have to terminate visit. What is included in reports. Objective observation, things said to children, interactions, communication. Pure observation. No recommendations, opinions etc. Pathway families move through when using supervision. Supervision can be longer term. Sometimes it can be very brief for some reassurance and to build trust. Reports can mirror back to parents what their actions are. How reports can provide feedback and be a mirror for parents. Locations and also the cost of supervision. Qualifications of supervisors and training they receive. Issue when parents are paying for supervision and they then perceive themselves as the client who is paying for the service. Zoe: “In a way it is parents paying for the service… the payer has the power… so how does that work in protecting and empowering children when they are not the payer?” “Sometimes clients say “Well I paid for you, you better put this in the report the way I want it”… and “We say excuse me no, our client is the child. And we are here to make sure we do everything in the best interests of the child….We don’t take stuff like that from clients.” Important things to remember to include in Orders when supervisors are appointed. Ie be careful about being too specific on times before you have the supervisor appointed, ie what if the supervisor cannot attend at this time. Leave flexibility for the times the supervisor can attend. “At a time chosen by the supervisor” or a wording that allows the supervisor to nominate the time.