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Unpacking lessons for the public service, starting with the Robodebt Royal Commission.
In 2019, after three years, Robodebt was found to be unlawful. The Royal Commission process found it was also immoral and wildly inaccurate.
In 2019, after three years, Robodebt was found to be unlawful. The Royal Commission process found it was also immoral and wildly inaccurate.
Ultimately the Australian Government was forced to pay $1.8bn back to more than 470,000 Australians.
In this podcast we dive deep into public policy failures like Robodebt and the British Post Office scandal - how they start, why they're hard to stop, and the public service lessons we shouldn't forget.
41 Episodes
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Danielle unpacks the recently released APS State of the Service, with a look over our should at where we’ve come from - from the 1976 Coombs Royal Commission on Australian Government Administration, to the 2019 Thodey Review of the APS. How are women, First Nations and people with disability going in the APS? What about class?Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely d...
Keeping track of the National Anti-Corruption Commission and Robodebt is tricky - first there's no investigation, then there's some kind of review, then there's a search for an eminent person....In this episode, we talk about where things are at, managing conflicts of interest, and whether corruption always involves brown paper bags.For Rick Morton's reporting on this:Eight minutes outside: how the NACC failed on robodebtNACC dumped Gleeson over concerns for CoalitionNACC integrity officer qu...
Post Office’s internal inquiries never got to the bottom of the situation. Here we unpack how to choose an investigator, getting the information to the person, and what do with a report.Opening grab from Sir Anthony Hooper, independent chair of Horizon mediation scheme.Subsequent grab from Mr Beer KC and Paula Vennels, former Post Office Limited Chief Executive. Subsequent grab Mr Beer KC and Alice Perkins, former Post Office Limited Chair. Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclai...
Post Office leadership commissioned at least 6 different investigations of varying degrees of independence and rigor into complaints about Horizon after 2010. And yet none of them got to the truth. In the next two episodes, we unpack what not to do when setting up inquiries and investigations. Opening grab from Mr Beer KC and Alice Perkins, former Post Office Limited Chair.Subsequent grab from Mr Beer KC and Alice Perkins, former Post Office Limited Chair.Final grab from Mr Beer KC and Rod Is...
Another great round of questions, thanks!Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details right.If you want rigorous reporting on Robodebt, we recommend the work of Rick Morton at the Saturday Paper, Chris Knaus and Luke Henriques-Gomes at the Guardian, Ben Eltham at Crikey, Julian Bajkowski at The Mandarin, and of course, the Robodeb...
Thanks for the questions folks!Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details right.If you want rigorous reporting on Robodebt, we recommend the work of Rick Morton at the Saturday Paper, Chris Knaus and Luke Henriques-Gomes at the Guardian, Ben Eltham at Crikey, Julian Bajkowski at The Mandarin, and of course, the Robodebt Royal Co...
The Australian Public Service Commission has released the findings of its Centralised Code of Conduct Inquiry into Robodebt.Outro grab from The West Wing, Season 3, Episode 10.Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details right.If you want rigorous reporting on Robodebt, we recommend the work of Rick Morton at the Saturday Paper, C...
In this episode, we look at why Post Office kept prosecuting Sub Post Masters through the lens of Dan Davies' analysis in his new book The Unaccountability Machine.Opening grab from Mr Beer KC (Counsel Assisting) and Alisdair Cameron, CFO and former interim CE of Post Office Ltd.Subsequent grab from Mr Blake KC (Counsel Assisting) and Graham Brander, former Post Office Investigator.Subsequent grab from Mr Beer KC and Anne Chambers, former Fujitsu Engineer Third Line Support.Final grab from Mr...
A massive power imbalance, everyone doing the narrowest version of their jobs, and an overriding culture that assumed postmasters were thieves. These are just some of the ways Post Office ended up prosecuting postmasters for shortfalls that existed only on the computer.Opening grab from Mr Beer KC (Counsel Assisting) and Rob Wilson, former Head of the Royal Mail Group Criminal Law Team.Subsequent grab from Mr Beer KC and Helen Rose, former Post Office / Royal Mail Group Auditor.Final grab fro...
In this episode, former state Minister for Health and the Arts (among others) the Hon John Hill, shares his insights into what Ministers want - and what they need - from the public service.You can buy his book ‘On being a Minister’ here - and if you’re brave, share with your Minister!Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details ri...
In this second interview with former Commonwealth Secretary and Australian Public Service Commissioner Andrew Podger AO, Danielle gets to chat aboutThe pros and cons of bringing all service delivery together in a single agency The valuing of operational expertise v policy leadershipThe role of portfolio budget practices in driving RobodebtCultures of challenge and diversity of thoughtThe future of public service reform.References in the episode2019 Thodey Review of Australian Public Serv...
With a decade as a Commonwealth Secretary, and two more as Australian Public Service Commissioner, it is no surprise Robodebt Royal Commissioner Holmes turned to Andrew Podger AO for expert advice on the operation of the public service.In this episode, Danielle talks to Andrew about the impact that granting tenure could have on the quality of advice, the increasing use of labour hire in the public service, and the importance of senior executives having read the legislation.Also referenced in ...
What does the community want more - every last transgressor to be punished, or government to keep out of their business?How can regulators keep pace with changing community expectations about what is ‘appropriate’ - and, indeed, what is a workplace?What is a regulator to do when you’re facing these issues in the full glare of media scrutiny?In this final episode of the Essendon mini-series, we think about what this footy doping scandal can tell us about the challenges of being a modern regula...
In episode two of this mini-series, we pick up the story of the Essendon supplements scandal from the perspective of the investigators.In this story we hear how ASADA ends up in the middle of a media fire storm, with inadequate regulatory powers and biopharmaceutical technology racing ahead.But is it really a matter for ASADA at all? Is this an anti-doping violation, or a WHS breach? And why do Cronulla players end up suspended for six matches, while Essendon players get two years?Intro grab ...
“Lack of good governance is why good people did bad things at Essendon Football Club”. So says Lindsay Tanner, former Minister for Finance, and President of the Essendon Football Club from 2015.In this mini-series, Caroline tries to convince us there are lessons for public servants from the Essendon Football Club supplement scandal in 2013.In this episode, we talk about what happened in Essendon itself. The dangers of charismatic new leaders, new brooms through an organisation, and a failure ...
In the second of two follow ups to her interview at the end of 2023, Sue Vardon dives deep on her commitment to training Centrelink staff, including the establishment of an in-house Registered Training Organisation (RTO).Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details right.If you want rigorous reporting on Robodebt, we recommend the...
In the first of two follow ups to her interview at the end of 2023, Sue Vardon returns to share her thoughts on the dangers for Senior Executives who outsource considerations of legality to the lawyers.Now for some appropriately bureaucratic disclaimers....While we have tried to be as thorough in our research as busy full time jobs and lives allow, we definitely don’t guarantee that we’ve got all the details right.If you want rigorous reporting on Robodebt, we recommend the work of Rick Morto...
Centrelink is not alone in having a push and pull between the investment required to get it right up front, versus the convenience of fixing things up later.We discuss the old chestnut 'fast, cheap, good - pick two' , and the less obvious costs of running lean - whether in pandemic preparedness, strategic policy capacity, workforce burnout.Finally, Danielle proposes an end to end definition of efficiency, that captures costs we move to other parts of government, or end up paying later on.ANAO...
If you knew your IT system was unreliable, wouldn't you keep some manual checks to make sure it doesn't go wrong? Not if you're Post Office, and desperately looking for savings. Especially if you've just lost your biggest revenue source, in the form of the Benefits Agency and the cash in the tills it provides.In the final episode of our first (but not last!) mini-series on the Post Office scandal, we examine how the Post Office 'forgot' what it knew about Horizon's unreliability, and then rem...
Despite hundreds of technical issues and continuing delays in meeting quality requirements, in January 2000, Post Office Board accepted the Horizon IT system as its own.In this episode, we discuss how hard it is to say 'stop' in the middle of a game of whack-a-mole of problem fixing, especially when there are institutional incentives to keep going. We also have strong feelings about the idea of 'minimum viable products' where the delivery of social services - and the founding of prosecutions ...
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