Transforming Tomorrow

We bring Season One of Transforming Tomorrow to a close with Jan answering some of the questions that have come up during previous episodes. Three big topics are covered. We take a deeper look at externalities, which have been mentioned several times. Jan explains what they are, and how (not a matter of when) they can be internalised. Jan lays out the case for business to know about externalities and do something proactive to address them before someone else internalises them for you. Jan also reflects on how the EU creates social and environmental effects outside of its borders and why it is important to know that this can happen. Justice – in its many forms – has also come up in many of our episodes, and Jan gives a taster of what it involves. Spoiler alert: there are many elements to justice. Plus, a sneak peek at what is coming up in Season Two. Find details on the Frontiers of Justice book Jan mentions here: https://www.hup.harvard.edu/books/9780674024106) And the paper on justice and earth systems is here: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41893-023-01064-1

Paul and Jan return to Australia, as Professor Nick Barter, from Griffith University, takes us through ‘future normal’. Nick discusses the origins of the phrase from his time working with industry while completing his PhD with Jan at the University of St Andrews. And he dives into the eight questions to create businesses your children will be proud of that are the focus of his book. Covering topics from corporate direction-setting and vision to culture and language, learning from nature, and enabling others, Nick talks to us about how companies can change to be part of a world they want to live in. Find out more about Future Normal here: https://futurenormal.net/

It’s a full house in the studio as Jan and Paul welcome Dr Elisavet Christou and Violet Owen to enlighten them on the world of creative evaluation. They are co-authors of the Little Book of Creative Evaluation, and explain just what Creative Evaluation is, and how it can be used across many disciplines, giving examples of how they have seen it applied. Elisavet and Violet discuss their EViD tool, which helps people with their evaluation processes; the value of hearing from many different voices, the importance of design, and why evaluation is so much more than a tick-box exercise. Jan gets to talk benchmarking again. And is Paul right to be worried that the team are secretly being evaluated the whole time? Check out the Little Book of Creative Evaluation here: https://creativeevaluation.uk/ And read a little more about the work here: https://doc.your-brochure-online.co.uk/Lancaster-University_FiftyFourDegrees_Issue_20/34/

Linden Edgell – Inquisitor, Collaborator and Explorer extraordinaire – joins Jan and Paul from Perth, Australia, among her 150 mango trees. Linden is ERM’s Global Sustainability Director and is also a member of the Pentland Centre’s Advisory Board. Trained as a social scientist, Linden has worked in government and latterly in consulting, where she is seeking to bring about change in corporate behaviour. Linden explains how she works with executives on how they can change their operations and attitudes – from nature restoration to modern slavery – and how it is hard to get people to accept the difficulty of the task. What changes has she seen over the decades? How do companies balance profit, sustainability and longevity? Can you walk and chew gum?

As we approach the conclusion of Series 1 of Transforming Tomorrow, find out what is still to come on the remaining episodes.

Farmed salmon is the UK’s biggest food export – and Dr Josi Fernandes is obsessed! Josi joins Jan and Paul to talk about her work looking at salmon farming practices and sustainability in the UK and how her research in the area all started over a conversation in the pub. We discover what Josi has learned from speaking with salmon farmers, processors and retailers – though not everyone wanted to talk. We take in the differences between farmed and wild salmon; how farmed salmon came to be such a big market; the industrial scale of production; the environmental impacts of the practice; potential futures for the industry; and whether anyone in the studio eats salmon in the first place. Find out more about Josi’s research here: https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/lums/people/josiane-fernandes2 You can discover Paul Greenberg’s Four Fish book here: https://www.paulgreenberg.org/books/four-fish/ And see more on Mark Kurlansky’s Salmon book here: https://www.markkurlansky.com/books/salmon-a-fish-the-earth-and-the-history-of-their-common-fate/

Jan and Paul welcome Professor Mark Shackleton to the podcast to discuss the world of finance and how it intersects with sustainability.  They discover why the King can’t enter the City of London without permission; whether investors actually care about sustainability – or are only in it for the profits; how data can be used to influence ‘green’ investing; and the power of shareholders to instigate change.  Among discussions of ethics and politics, they find the time to talk about physics and Paul’s strange childhood fascination with global stock exchanges.  Find out more about Mark’s research here: https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/lums/people/mark-shackleton

Is it possible that consumers can change how businesses operate through buying more sustainable products? Jan and Paul welcome back Professor Dakshina De Silva, and Drs Anita Schiller and Aurelie Slechten to discuss the factors that influence consumer spending on green goods; different cultural attitudes towards green spending; how income levels affect these attitudes; and whether the future is carrying your own ice cream spoon around in your pocket. Read more about the team’s research into green consumer spending in this short article: https://doc.your-brochure-online.co.uk/Lancaster-University_FiftyFourDegrees_Issue_18/10/

A crash of economists invades the studio to talk to Jan and Paul about how industrial pollution ties in with economics and sustainability. Professor Dakshina De Silva, and Drs Anita Schiller and Aurelie Slechten explain how economists view the world – how they analyse how people make choices – and how we can measure the social costs of pollution. Their work shows how communities with lower-income residents can be impacted more by pollution, but why does that happen, and can anything be done to stop this happening in future? With pollution impacting health and employment opportunities, can regulations help these communities? Will they make industries pack up and move elsewhere – leaving even fewer job opportunities? Or is that just a handy excuse? The trio take through these issues and many more – and we discover shockingly that there may be a ‘Wrong Side’ of the river in Lancaster.

Take a sneak peek into upcoming topics on Transforming Tomorrow - from salmon farming to the economics of pollution, sustainable finance, and more.

Where’s Jan? Paul is left to fly solo after a car breakdown means Jan cannot make it to Orton, and the farm of Jim Beary. Luckily, Lake District Farmers Head of Purpose and Sustainability Phil Scott is able to help out as the trio discuss life at Gaythorn Hall, a farm in the far east of Cumbria, that actually falls within the boundaries of the Yorkshire Dales National Park. From his home among the flocks of sheep and herds of cows – as well as smaller numbers of pigs and chickens – Jim tells us about his past experiences in farming – including a ‘horrifying’ time on an arable farm as a crop sprayer – and his determination to do things less intensively and more sustainably to create high-quality food. We learn about his work planting new hedgerows, the benefits for him of working with LDF, how to adapt to circumstances and the environment, the importance of feeling a connection with nature and wanting to succeed in making changes, how he has learned from his mistakes, soil resilience and more sustainable feed types. You can see Jim’s Instagram account at @farmer_beary

Paul and Jan have finally made it to the farm! Continuing the series with Lake District Farmers, we are on Cartmel Fell, in South Cumbria, to meet Fiona Daley, who along with her husband Dave owns and runs Hodge Hill Farm. Fiona and Dave have a small herd of Belted Galloway cows and are members of the LDF network. LDF Head of Purpose and Sustainability Phil Scott joins everyone in the barn – where a newborn calf came into the world only a day earlier – to discuss key sustainability issues. They discuss why Dave and Fiona returned to farming seven years ago with a determination to do things differently; the significance of regenerative farming, wildlife and nature – and of sharing best practices across farms; good genetics and health in breeding; the process of maturing cows slowly for market; and the wince-inducing difference between a bull and a steer. And we even get to talk farming numbers, as it turns out Fiona is a qualified accountant.

Dr Laura Giles, the Knowledge Transfer Partnership Associate working with Lake District Farmers, comes in to join Jan and Paul to discuss her work – and tell us what her role means and how it operates. Laura is working with LDF to understand how livestock farmers in the Lake District can work towards Net Zero meat production (the project is not making wild claims of Net Zero meat). This takes in soil science, farming practice, and even accounting – to Jan’s delight. Discover the unique challenges facing farmers in the Lake District relating to the landscape and soil; find out how farmers are cooperating with Laura’s research; and learn the differences between Net Zero, Carbon Neutral and Carbon Positive. Watch a film showcasing some of the work taking place on the KTP here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZmmOGboCbE

Jan and Paul are back at the Lake District Farmers’ base in Ulverston to talk with Phil Scott, Head of Purpose and Sustainability at LDF, about the organisation’s sustainability ambitions. As seagulls and buzzards circle, they look at how LDF think about sustainability in their own operations, the operations of the farmers in their networks, and the overall impact of their work. Phil explains it is more than carbon offsetting, but rather the efforts reflect engagement with their communities, proper discussions with farmers around their practices and biodiversity, and a real understanding of the natural environment of the Lake District. Plus what are the general attitudes in farming towards sustainability, and we look at the key issue of how eating meat can fit into a sustainable lifestyle.

Professors Jess Davies and John Quinton, from Lancaster Environment Centre, bring their expertise in soil into the studio.  From the many different types of soil to its carbon storage properties – there is more carbon in soil than in the Earth’s atmosphere – and how human activity has changed soils over the centuries, there is much to explore.  With a focus the work being done with the Lake District Farmers, Jess and John tell Jan and Paul, what effects do farmers have on their land – and how they have affected it over the past centuries – and what might happen in the future. Using science, they can advise on the best path forward.  Plus, a bonus mention of Pliny the Elder!  Find out more about the Sustainable Soils research group in Lancaster Environment Centre here: https://wp.lancs.ac.uk/sustainable-soils/ 

We start our new series of episodes looking at meat farming in the UK’s Lake District by meeting the Lake District Farmers organisation.  Jan and Paul travel to Ulverston – or Oolverston as Jan would have it – to meet LDF Head of Purpose and Sustainability Phil Scott and find all about the organisation and its work with farmers across the county of Cumbria.  LDF work with a network of around 50 farmers who have native breed cattle, sheep, and pigs to process and selling high-quality meat. But how do they work together? How does this network benefit the farmers involved? Why do top chefs in London want their products? Why are they working with Lancaster University – and how? And what are the challenges facing the Lake District’s fell farmers? 

Over the next six weeks on Transforming Tomorrow, we will be taking a deep dive into the Towards Net Zero Meat Production project. This is a collaboration between Lancaster University - including the Pentland Centre - and the Lake District Farmers organisation. Jan and Paul will be speaking to experts in Lancaster, the Lake District Farmers, and farmers in Cumbria (on their farms) to find our more. Take a sneak peek here.

Professor Henrik Österblom, Director of the Anthropocene Laboratory at the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences, comes to the podcast with possibly the best job title so far. Henrik is one of Jan’s favourite super-scientists, and he joins Jan and Paul from Stockholm. But just what does Anthropocene mean, and how does it tie in with sustainability? How is the world changing due to human activity? How have we affected the behaviour of animals – do frogs really eat lightbulbs? What are the empirics of hope? Are there positive signs that we can tackle the challenges we face? How does art and creativity fit into sustainability science? And just what is Henrik’s favourite seabird (and Jan and Paul’s)? Find out more about the Anthropocene Lab and its work here: https://www.anthropocenelab.se/   And you can discover the Sounds of Science book Henrik talks about here: https://www.sciencedirect.com/book/9780443152672/the-sounds-of-science 

We’ve discussed modern slavery on a global scale before, but now Dr Divya Jyoti joins Jan and Paul to bring the issue closer to home. Divya’s research has taken her to the factory floor, and to the city of Leicester – where there were once claims of 10,000 people living in modern slavery – and has led her to shine a light on left-behind people, those often-forgotten people in our societies. What has Divya learned from her work in Leicester? What have been the effects on the city of the allegations and investigations? Have people paid enough attention to the impacts on the communities? Find out more about Divya’s work on modern slavery in the fashion industry here: https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/news/spotlight/modern-slavery/

In 2023, around 6.8 million people in the UK were in severely insecure work – little over a firth of the working population. Work Foundation Director Ben Harrison dials in from London to discuss the issue. Ben tells Jan and Paul about how the Work Foundation works as it tries to influence policy across the UK. He covers issues of flexible working, how economic changes in recent years have affected working patterns, and the effects of the Covid 19 pandemic. What are decent and insecure work? How does the Work Foundation’s Insecure Work Index function, and what does it tell us? Are particular groups and parts of the country more affected by insecure work? What responsibilities do employers have towards their employees during times of financial hardship? Discover more about the Work Foundation’s research and activities on insecure work here: https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/work-foundation/our-work/insecure-work/