407: Do You Have a "Self?"

407: Do You Have a "Self?"

Update: 2024-07-29
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Special Announcement #1

Attend the Legendary Summer Intensive

Featuring Drs. David Burns and Jill Levitt

August 8 - 11. 2024

Learn Advanced TEAM-CBT skills

Heal yourself, heal your patients

First Intensive in 5 years!

It will knock your socks off!

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Sadly, this workshop is a training program which will be limited to therapists and mental health professionals and graduate students in a mental health field  Apologies, but therapists have complained when non-therapists have attended our continuing education training programs. This is partly because of the intimate nature of the small group exercises and the personal work the therapists may do during the workshop. Certified coaches and counselors are welcome to attend.

Special Announcement #2

Here's some GREAT news! The Feeling Great App is now available in both app stores (IOS and Android) and is for therapists and the general public, and you can take a ride for free! Check it

Today's Podcast

Practical Philosophy Month

Part 2, Do Humans have “Selves”?

This is our second podcast in our Practical Philosophy Month. Last week, in our first episode, we focused on the “free will” question. As humans, we all feel like we have “free will,” but is it just an illusion, especially if all our actions are the result of the physical processes in our brains and the laws of the universe?

The Bible certainly dealt with this in the book of Genesis, where we learn that the first humans, Adam and Eve, were given a wonderful Garden of Eden to live in, but they had to choose whether or not to obey God’s rule NOT to eat the forbidden fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. They chose to eat the fruit, implying that humans have free choice. But the philosophical arguments rage on.

In today’s podcast, we are joined by two beloved and brilliant colleagues, Drs. Matthew May and Fabrice Nye, as we explore the question of whether or not the “self” exists. We all feel like we have a “self,” but is this real or just an illusion? When you try to define your “self,” you may run into problems.

For example, you might think that the “self” has to be the part of us that does not change from moment to moment, and is always ‘the same.” For example, I might think back on my childhood and feel convinced that I was the “same David Burns” then that I am now. And, if you are religious, you might also be comforted by the idea that your “self” is the same as your “soul,” and that you will therefore live on after you die. This concept of a “soul” is a core belief in many religions.

But are we fooling ourselves? And what was the Buddha thinking about 2,500 years ago when we talked about enlightenment as resulting from the “Great Death” of the “self.” He seemed to be hinting that something wonderful can happen when you give up the idea that you have a “self.”

In the original draft of my book, Feeling Great, I had a chapter on entitled, “Do you need a “self?” Join the Grateful Dead.” I tried to persuade readers that the existence of a “self” is nonsense, based on the philosophy of Ludwig Wittgenstein in his famous book, Philosophical Investigations. But readers found the chapter so upsetting that I decided, on their urging, to delete it from the manuscript, which I did. My goal is not to disturb people, but to provide a path to joy and to loving connections with others.

But to this day, I still get emails from people asking me to offer that chapter, or to deal more deeply with this concept of the “self” vs “no self” in a podcast. So, here is my attempt today.

I will start with my own take, and then summarize some of the views about the self that were expressed by Fabrice, Matt, and Rhonda during the show.

Here’s my thinking. There are many key questions you could ask about the concept of the “self?” including:

  1. Do we have a “self?”
  1. And if so, what is it?
  1. Does the first question even make sense?

I’m sure you would agree that if a question doesn’t make sense, then it isn’t a “real” question, and there really isn’t anything to talk about. Then we can just stop feeling frustrated and perplexed, and move on with our lives.

That is the precise position that the late Wittgenstein would probably have taken. He stated that words have no ultimate or “true” meaning outside of the various contexts in which we use them in daily life. Most words have many meanings, because they are used in different ways, and you can find most of the meanings in any dictionary.

So, if you think of the word, “game,” you will quickly realize that it does not have one “true” or essential meaning. It can mean a sports competition, with two teams competing against each, like soccer. But you can have two teams competing in some way other than a sport.

And you don’t even need two teams to have a “game.” For example, some games are played by one individual, like solitaire with a deck of cards.

Or you can think about the “dating game,” or refer to “game birds,” or a “game boxer.” In short, there is not some single “correct” meaning to the word, “game.” Some uses have overlapping meanings, and some uses do not overlap at all with other uses.

So, there is no point in trying to figure out if “games exist,” or what the ultimate or essential meaning is of the word, “game.”

Now, how do we use the word, “self,” and what does it mean in each context?

You might tell your child to behave themself. This simply means that they are misbehaving and will be punished if they don’t behave more politely. You do not have to tell the child that their “self” also has to behave better, because that would be meaningless. We already told the child to change their behavior.

You could ask friends, as I did this morning, if they are planning to join me on the Sunday hike. Two of them confirmed and said that “they” would join me today on our hike. I did have to ask them if they would be bringing their “selves,” because I just do not know what that would mean! They already told me they’re coming to the hike. (They did come and we had a lot of fun.)

In my extremely challenging freshman English class at Amherst College, we had to write two or three papers per week on odd topics. The teachers were relentlessly critical in their feedback, and would nearly always point out that we sounded incredibly phony and need to find our true voices, which came from our real selves, as opposed to the false fronts we often used to try to impress people. Almost every student got dumped on constantly!

The professors weren’t referring to some metaphysical “true selves.” They were just referring to the fact that our writing didn’t sound natural, compelling, or vulnerable, and so forth. Our writing was, for the most part, an enormous turn-off. Most of us never could figure out quite what that class was all about, but it was useful as I became more sensitive to the “tone” or “voice” in any writing.

I would have to concede that it was a sobering but helpful class. But they were not referring to some mystical “true self” we had to find. They just wanted us to stop writing in such a sucky way!

So here is my point, which you might “not get.” When you keep the word, “self,” in the context of everyday life, it is obvious what it means, and it never refers to some metaphysical “thing” that we could “have” or “not have.” It is just a vague, abstract concept that is devoid of meaning when it’s all by itself. A “self,” just like “free will,” is not some “thing” that we might, or might not, have.

The question, “Does the self exist,” according to Wittgenstein (or his big fan David) has no meaning and so we can just ignore it. It’s not a real question. It is, as Wittgenstein was fond of saying, “language that’s out of gear.”

Now, does this discussion have anything to do with emotional problems, or TEAM therapy? It absolutely does. That’s because nearly all depression results from some version of “I’m not good enough,” including:

  • I’m inferior.
  • I’m a loser.
  • I’m a “hopeless case.”
  • I’m a failure.
  • I’m unlovable.
  • I’m a bad parent.
  • I’m defective.

And so forth.

If you buy into these “self” condemning proclamations, thinking that they mean something, you’ll probably feel depressed, ashamed, inadequate, hopeless, and more. As you can probably see, all these self-critical thoughts contain tons of cognitive distortions, like All-or-Nothing Thinking, Overgeneralization, Labeling, Mental Filtering, Emotional Reasoning, Self-Blame, Hidden Shoulds, and more

And to put it in a nutshell, they ALL involve the belief that you have a “self” that’s broken, or simply not “good enough.” And all of those statements are meaningless.

My goal in therapy is NOT to persuade you that you ARE worthwhile, or “a winner,” or a “good” parent, but rather to show you how to let go of these meaningless but painful ways of belittling yourself. I

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407: Do You Have a "Self?"

407: Do You Have a "Self?"