Bitcoin is becoming the foundation of a new financial and technological order. In this episode, Christian Catalini shares why open networks must win over corporate blockchains, how the Lightning Network and Spark are unlocking true global payments, and what lessons he learned building Libra inside Facebook. We explore the limits of stablecoins, the risks of leverage, and why proof of work may be humanity’s greatest defense in a world racing toward automation.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome and guest intro

00:20 - The MIT bitcoin experiment

02:09 - Why Christian is a bitcoin pragmatist

02:30 - Linux analogy for bitcoin

04:11 - Making Lightning Network enterprise grade

05:37 - Before Lightspark: MIT professor to fintech researcher

08:12 - Inside Project Libra

10:04 - Building on permissionless open networks

11:10 - When block subsidies fall to zero

15:06 - How AI reshapes work and value

17:31 - Why AI agents should not hold wallets

18:40 - Micropayments for agents with Lightning

20:29 - Are we plateauing or accelerating in AI

22:49 - Redefining capitalism for the AI era

24:18 - The real AI risk: unknown preferences

26:51 - bitcoin and money in an automated world

28:24 - Proof of work as time and energy

31:32 - Is AI bigger than bitcoin

32:27 - The current state of the Lightning Network

44:24 - Thoughts on Saylor’s preferred equity

47:40 - Closing call to builders to choose open networks