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Ep405 Detox Crimes
Update: 2025-01-30
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This week, the gals mix up some green juice and delve into some unwell wellness treatments. Topics include a dubious digital detox, some over-the-top purging methods, and an ongoing murder investigation with a complicated web of players. Pick up your favorite new canned mocktail, be sure to include emojis, and tune in for Detox Crimes.
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Transcript
00:00:00
Wine and Crime contains graphic and explicit content which may not be suitable for some listeners.
00:00:05
"Listener discretion" is advised.
00:00:08
You are listening to Wine and Crime, the podcast where two friends,
00:00:27
Chagwain, Chat True Crime, and unleash their worst Minnesotan accent.
00:00:32
"Sure do! Sure do, I'm Lucy."
00:00:34
"I'm Amanda, coming out from the crack of dawn at 11 a.m."
00:00:38
This is obscenely early.
00:00:41
"My god."
00:00:42
"I straightened my hair before 9 a.m. I feel like I'm in corporate America again. I don't like it."
00:00:48
"I would shower and did my hair yesterday and then this is just like the brushed out
00:00:53
slept on result that we're working with here."
00:00:56
"It looks really cute."
00:00:57
"And I have a clip."
00:00:58
"I have a little clip. I couldn't bring myself to put makeup on."
00:01:02
"I can't. Well, it's 2025. I'm over it. I'm over it. I'm going full Pamela Anderson."
00:01:09
"Yes, good. I've been really into skin care."
00:01:14
"You're glowing."
00:01:16
"I have no fewer than six products on my face under any sort of tinted moisturizer
00:01:23
concealer anything."
00:01:24
"Oh yeah. This is the way we have to exist now if we want to have skin."
00:01:29
"Yeah, but I kind of love it."
00:01:32
"It's nice. I have my serums and my under eye creams on right now too. I just didn't put any
00:01:37
makeup on over it because you know what? Fuck 'em. Fuck 'em all."
00:01:41
"Fuck 'em all."
00:01:43
"Fuck 'em all."
00:01:44
"Okay. Speaking of fucking 'em all and serums, etc. Remaining youthful might we say,
00:01:52
we have a very special fan pick today."
00:01:55
"Okay."
00:01:56
"From listener Molly Walker."
00:01:59
"Yes."
00:01:59
"Molly selected the topic of detox crimes."
00:02:04
"Yeah. Um, I guess remaining youthful, there are a lot of ways you could interpret the word detox."
00:02:13
"That's a whole thing. We'll get to it."
00:02:16
"Yeah, I would pick a juice cleanse."
00:02:18
"She picked my fan pick case and the detox connection is in the world of addictionology,
00:02:27
which is like a whole thing obviously, but yeah, there are certainly wellness quote-unquote
00:02:32
detoxes that might be total bullshit, might be beneficial, who knows."
00:02:38
"We'll get to all of it."
00:02:39
"Great. Molly actually suggested my case too."
00:02:43
"I love it."
00:02:43
"Got a little case, Molly, you're full of ideas."
00:02:46
"You are, Molly. Miles vows."
00:02:49
"Miles vows to the wows."
00:02:51
"Miles to the wows."
00:02:52
"Before we get to detoxing Amanda, how about you tell us how to
00:02:57
talk in the first place?"
00:02:59
"Well, why can't I be wearing?"
00:03:00
"Molly also recommended we go NA this episode, which I appreciate, especially since we're
00:03:07
recording it at 11 a.m. And you know, I know she said she suggested talking about
00:03:14
NA beer or wine, which like I have done before. I'm not so much of an NA beer girly, my husband
00:03:22
likes the NA beers, but that's not really my jam. But I wasn't really like that big of a beer
00:03:29
drinker in the first place. I'm like a cocktail bitch. Like wine and cocktails are where my bread
00:03:35
and butter are. But there is nothing I love more, honestly, from like the, if it's really good,
00:03:43
the flavor standpoint, but the convenience standpoint. Then a craft cocktail in a can.
00:03:49
Yeah. Which kind of like breaches the gap between the cocktail beer zone. So I went on the search
00:03:59
for canned mocktails. Wow. And found this great article from last year from the kitchen.com, where
00:04:09
essentially someone did exactly what I didn't have the patience to do, which is like try all of these
00:04:16
popular canned mocktails that are on the market right now and give recommendations on what they think
00:04:22
are the best. And I want to go over some of the standouts. So our brave McKenzie Filsen
00:04:28
went on the hunt for like the best canned mocktails. She tried 41 different canned mocktails.
00:04:37
My god. Something they were NA. Yeah. Some did have like CBD or THC. So we'll we'll
00:04:45
I'll make sure to flag that if that's in one of the selections. But most of them are just straight
00:04:51
up NA. No altering substances and just delicious. But I'm not going to go over all 41. And neither did
00:05:00
she. She said these are the eight that she found were like the standout best ones. Some I've heard of
00:05:07
some I have not. So I'm curious if you've heard of any of these. The recess zero proof lime margarita.
00:05:14
I've heard of recess. It's infused with gaya gayausa and adaptogen and it is a little bit sparkling.
00:05:24
It looks really delicious. A 12 pack retails for like 30 bucks. These aren't cheap. But they are
00:05:32
like really nice high quality products. So if you're margarita girly the recess zero proof lime
00:05:38
margarita might be the one for you. If you're more of a mojito girly the ish i s h mindful drinking
00:05:49
co non alcoholic mojito with ish Caribbean spiced spirit. I don't know what that means mint
00:05:57
and lime. It's like a fresh Caribbean breeze for your mouth. So the writer says weird flex. I know
00:06:04
but my first alcoholic beverage ever was a mojito. That's really cute. It's cute that it wasn't like
00:06:09
UV blue in a closet in a basement at a house party like it was for us. Just a picture of beer.
00:06:16
That you get for free if you drink it in under two minutes. She says sure. That's like saying my
00:06:21
first word was regatta. But it just is the truth. I went into tasting all the varieties of ename
00:06:28
mojitos with a lot of expectations. The one that really mimicked the balance of a well-made
00:06:32
mojito ish's mojito. The proprietary Caribbean spiced enne spirit nails the rummy backbone of a classic
00:06:40
mojito. The ish mojito also stands out for its peppy burst of spear mint and tinges of fresh lime.
00:06:46
If you like me enjoy when canned mojitos don't shy away from adding a bit of faux alcohol burn or
00:06:51
bitterness. I think you'll be as bold over by ish's full selection to bonus the ish's mo the ish
00:06:58
mojito also looks pretty damn near identical to an actual mojito when put in an ice and ice
00:07:04
filled highball glass with mint meaning it's a great mocktail for when you want to really blend in
00:07:08
amongst a less than dry crowd. I think that's kind of a cool element to it. And I am seeing in
00:07:15
mocktails the use of these of different components that do give that like the burn the bitterness.
00:07:22
And yeah I mean it gives it kind of an author. I don't know the science behind like what they're
00:07:28
putting in that that does that that is an alcohol but it exists and it's very creative and clever
00:07:34
and I think that is super fucking cool. Yeah this I have tried is the phoning agrony. This is from
00:07:44
saint agristis. I'm not really an agrony person but I do like this. It's in this really cool bottle
00:07:52
that is like do you remember when we used to get the like bj's wine coolers in the glass bottles
00:08:00
that are kind of like stout. Yeah it's still short. Yeah this is kind of like that but it's like
00:08:06
triangular and spherical and doesn't have any other like dips or ridges in the glass like I
00:08:13
I I was drawn to this immediately when I saw it at a bar because I was like oh my god that looks
00:08:18
crazy and I didn't even know that it was na and they were like yeah it's an end in agrony and I was
00:08:22
like I want to fucking try that and it was quite good and I'm not usually like an agrony person
00:08:27
maybe I just because I don't actually really love the alcohol that's that makes up an agrony
00:08:32
not having it. An na tastes better. It makes it taste better for me. It's good. She said these
00:08:38
bottled na and agronies pack in all that I know and love in a classic agrony herbal juniper
00:08:43
the bite of bitter orange and subtle florals. In other words this was a drink concocted by the best
00:08:48
of all people complete drink nerds and I love them for that. So it does capture those like
00:08:54
aromatics and that like it's kind of like an herbal upper teeth kind of vibe but without the like
00:08:59
gut punch like sting that I usually get from an agrony that makes it like so bitter that I
00:09:05
I'm like I don't really. You can actually taste yeah and enjoy all flavors and not be overwhelmed by
00:09:11
the booze part of it. Exactly. Okay I feel like I'm seeing this crap cocktail brand kind of going
00:09:19
viral like everywhere. It's called Gia or Gia GHIA and they specialize in more of like
00:09:27
the spritz side of mocktails. So the one she highlighted here is the G I'm going to just say Gia.
00:09:34
Gia Sumak chili lispritz. So that sounds amazing. She says I'm not proud to admit this but it must be
00:09:43
said because it really shows how much I love Gia's newest lispritz canned mocktail. Recently I was giving
00:09:48
it that logo. Yeah I'm seeing it everywhere. Vintage like 60's diagonal. Yeah it's the branding is
00:09:57
adorable. Maybe that's fucking why we're seeing it everywhere. Yes. Recently I was giving a friend a
00:10:02
few cans of my favorite mocktails as she was wanting to try out sober curiosity herself. Of course
00:10:06
I curated a delicious selection. I thought she would like except I completely kept all the Gia
00:10:11
cans to myself. So I love that she's like I'm going to put together this really nice curated
00:10:17
bunch of NA beverages but the ones that I'm obsessed with I'm just going to hoard all for myself
00:10:22
which is like so something I would do. I bought you this and I loved it so I kept it. Before you
00:10:28
say it I just know you'd do the same especially with the Sumak and chili flavor. What starts as a
00:10:33
subtle kick of heat quickly blossoms into a tangy bit of sunshiney Sumak that's juicy without
00:10:40
being coingly sweet. Mmm fucking yum. Yeah. Basically it's like tasting fireworks and it made me
00:10:46
briefly consider siding up for salsa lessons. Just need my advice and be sure to keep a stash
00:10:51
of these in a secret place. I mean everything I have like seen and read about this Gia brand of NA
00:10:58
canned cocktails is like everyone fucking loves it. Mmm hmm. There is a New Orleans crafted cocktail.
00:11:06
It's called mockly. They're booze-free cocktails and this one is called the eye opener. It's a
00:11:13
tangerine basil elixir. Oh yeah. Right. Right. Oh that sounds so good. I cannot. She says simply put
00:11:25
mockly's canned cocktails are on a mission to not just mimic popular cocktail flavors but instead
00:11:30
opt for flavors that can stand on their own without comparison. As my favorite of the bunch
00:11:35
eye opener blends bright juicy tangerine with herbal basil that feels like you're drinking the first
00:11:40
warm day that finally breaks through winter but in a can. Why am I gonna cry? I'm gonna cry. My
00:11:46
seasonal depression. I'm tearing up. Fucking add to cart. Yeah. James is mockly eye open. I'm
00:11:56
literally getting emotional. I know. That was like so beautiful. Okay. If you are a THC
00:12:03
mocktail girly, this one was recommended. It's the heirloom a Y R L O O M micro honey crisp.
00:12:11
This is a hemp infuse beverage. So I think it's only got one milligram of THC in it and then 15
00:12:20
milligrams of CBG which is similar to CBD but it's like a it's kind of like the Delta 9 of CBD
00:12:27
where it's like a hemp derived CBD. So it's technically classified in a different way.
00:12:32
So one molecule different exactly and this is more, you know, this is more for like your calm,
00:12:38
your relaxation. This is a beverage that's gonna have stuff like adaptogens but tannicles, you know,
00:12:45
it's it's kind of like the crunchy granola wellness relaxation kind of drink if that's your jam.
00:12:52
She said unlike many other tanned can't THC mocktails I tried heirloom comes in a can with just one
00:12:59
milligram THC and 15 milligrams of CBD per mini can whereas others range from 2 to 2.5 milligrams
00:13:06
of THC. So if you do want something that is, you know, gonna bring some of that relaxation but not
00:13:13
make you feel altered really in any way. Not make your eyes hot. Yeah. This is gonna be like a good,
00:13:19
you know, a good a good reach for you. It's an easier dose to handle for those who are
00:13:24
lightweight or want to drink another one later. The heirloom cans provided the most balanced high
00:13:29
with a smoother onset drinkable edible THC products. Hit your bloodstream a bit more rapidly than
00:13:34
smoking alone. I don't find that to be true. I find that it's the opposite for me. Smoking hits me
00:13:41
immediately the hardest. Then drinking is liquid metabolizes way faster than like a gummy.
00:13:49
Then gummies those usually take me like 25 to 30 minutes to start feeling anything. And then like 45.
00:13:56
Sometimes I like totally forget I ate one and then I have at the antique mall like
00:14:00
1000% and that's my experience with like baked goods too. Where I'll eat a brownie and then not
00:14:08
feel anything and then like two hours later and I guess like hello gastroparesis my digestion is
00:14:13
slow. It's like of course it's gonna take for fucking ever to metabolize and then it's like oh
00:14:18
shit I'm on the moon. So you know eat a drink responsibly. But yeah that was a good recommendation.
00:14:24
Another one that I actually haven't tried but I am a massive fan of spindrift sparkling water.
00:14:30
Yes. They make a no-hito. So this is spindrift sparkling water with lime and mint. So it's like
00:14:41
all the fixings of a mojito without the rum and it's it's like a nice tart lime. It has you know not
00:14:50
too much sweetness. That's one of the things I love about the spindrift is that like I can still drink
00:14:54
them even though I'm diabetic without having like dump insulin in my system because it's usually
00:14:59
only like three or four carbs. It's just like a little bit of fruit juice that's in there.
00:15:03
Mojitos can be so sweet like if you still want to make a legitimate I guess you know or alcoholic
00:15:09
mojito. This could also be a good mixer where it's like you could find a little balance because
00:15:13
mojitos have that like muddled up sugar in the bottom. So I kind of want to try that at some point
00:15:19
but I definitely want to pick up the no-hito lime and mint spindrift. Filio this is a little bit more
00:15:27
of a splurge they said for cans but the the sorry Filia Filia fiori fiori frisante not like not
00:15:36
like we just got back from Italy or anything. This is supposed to she says mimic traipsing into a hole
00:15:43
in the wall seaside Italian treptori appartivo in hand dressed in a sundress showing off just the
00:15:50
right tan to sunburn ratio. Oh my god again sounds like heaven. Perky crackling bubbles on my taste buds
00:15:58
don't hide anything but rather reveal a lemon and bitter orange juiciness that counters the rosy
00:16:04
floral top notes that make this a spritz for the crowds who want more citrus sweetness over
00:16:08
something more classically bitter forward. So if you're a little bit on the sweeter side with your
00:16:13
cocktails this Filia fiori frisante might be perfect for you to balance out this daydream should
00:16:18
you choose to float on in it be sure to go full appartivo hour by full appartivo hour by coupling
00:16:26
the Filia Fiori frisante with a bowl of salty kettle cook chips girl twist my arm yeah she's
00:16:32
speaking your fucking language. Jesus that was the other one of my favorite things about Italy.
00:16:38
They give you little snacks. They did stop for a drink. Yes that's everywhere chips for free at like
00:16:43
every single bar you grabbed a glass of wine from. And remember that one when you were getting
00:16:48
your tattoo and I sat in head of drink they brought me a full tray three different types of hummus
00:16:54
with all sorts of vegetables. Top of Nod bread. You came and met me and you were like oh did you order
00:17:00
food. I was like no bitch. I ordered one cocktail. Yeah and then I was like this would cost $25
00:17:07
at a like beautiful little bistro in the United States and they just plopped this on your table
00:17:13
for fucking free. I know I was like I didn't order this they're like you got a drink. This is what you
00:17:18
get. It's like their version of bar peanuts but it's so elevated and it hasn't had like 5,000
00:17:26
people's hands in it. Yeah we need to move to Italy. I don't seriously. Anyway I thought that that
00:17:31
list was really fun and showed like a wide variety of different canned cocktails and I have you know
00:17:37
said it many times before I think it's super cool how like sober and NA culture is becoming so much
00:17:43
more mainstream and so much more accepted and I really embrace that even though I'm not like a
00:17:50
sober person I often choose not to drink alcohol just for my own benefit and my own health and
00:17:58
having things like this available and I like I live with the sober person so things that have like
00:18:04
been a huge game changer are like the THC beverages different kinds of sparkling water. I mean bill
00:18:10
was such a beer guy that like he goes through sparkling water like an absolute fiend but it's like
00:18:16
it gives that satisfaction of like I'm cracking it I'm getting that effervescence I'm getting that
00:18:20
like popping bubble cold hit to the back of my throat. It's like I just think that that kind of
00:18:25
stuff is very cool to help people with their transition in these changes that they're choosing
00:18:31
to make and I think that that's fucking awesome. Also the two summers ago when I was pregnant
00:18:37
that summer and we were doing like shows all over particularly when we were in New York City in
00:18:42
that July. There were mocktails every single place we went and they were all so delicious and like
00:18:49
just everybody as carefully made as they were so good on their menu and it's really common now to
00:18:54
see a full mocktail section on a cocktail menu which I really appreciate like not even that long ago
00:19:02
like pre-COVID I feel like we know I never saw this it was like very rare to see this and like
00:19:08
sipping a mocktail there's something about it it's just like there's like no there's it makes it
00:19:13
kind of slow down a little bit you're just enjoying all the different layers of flavors and everything
00:19:18
and then you're not like oh like I feel like shit and I have harper and now I can't drive home yeah
00:19:24
whoops oh yeah we will definitely post that link like with our sources if you want to check it out
00:19:34
it's a really really cool list and then it does have links to where you can buy those products a lot
00:19:39
of them can be ordered online there are a lot of them you can just search and find it your like
00:19:43
local retailers but I thought that list was really cool and had a lot of different
00:19:47
types of any beverages for like kind of everybody who likes any kind of cocktail so I thought I would
00:19:55
share it and I hope you all enjoy and I'm drinking some mushroom adaptogen tea out of my tobeens mug
00:20:03
beautiful some mudwater hmm yeah that also these kind of drinks give you an option that isn't
00:20:10
water or pop yep yeah so yeah I mean they're just a more elevated like people who are mature yeah
00:20:18
people who don't drink alcohol still deserve to have like a unique elevated an adult beverage adult
00:20:26
experience and especially if you're going somewhere fancy where the food is really you know
00:20:31
expertly curated and they like there are all these opportunities for pairings I think having
00:20:36
options like that for people who don't drink is just like equitable service for everybody
00:20:42
mocktail pairings that be fun so yeah cheers to not drinking alcohol today
00:20:50
yeah I had my belly scope yesterday oh we'll soar down there so not fun I have to get an endoscopy
00:20:58
in February yeah you know we're pushing 40 these are the things that happen oh if me ketamine
00:21:06
oh yeah well fucks me up all day yeah you were a little loopy yesterday it was really cute I like
00:21:12
your voice memos and your videos I just didn't I was over texting so I just sent Amanda a bunch of
00:21:18
voice memos and videos I'm here for it you have to stop on the couch like brilliant ideas you were
00:21:23
cooking I was like letter hook I did have some good ideas you fucking did you cooked and I was here for
00:21:30
it ketamine man well don't recommend but well I had to get it for medical reasons under the right
00:21:42
circumstances taken responsibly and advised by a medical professional everything it can be just fine
00:21:51
and what that said should we take a quick break to your award from our sponsors
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apostrophe for sponsoring this episode okay welcome back Lucy what is our background maybe psych
00:27:56
and it sounds like a little fan picker case dabble for detox crimes got a little case for us I
00:28:04
feel like we've talked about I didn't really want to focus so much on like detoxing from an addiction
00:28:12
sure like a rehab situation today so we're gonna touch on that but I'm also gonna talk about the
00:28:19
health stuff that I mentioned and then we'll dive into a very specific kind of detoxing okay starting
00:28:24
at the top in general what does detox even mean a good question so the University of Chicago medicine
00:28:33
cows it quote the process of removing toxins a generic term for something that makes you feel
00:28:38
on well from the body so just a different differentiate a little bit your own body is designed to
00:28:45
perform detoxification in your liver and your kidneys which filter blood and separate harmful
00:28:51
substances to be processed and removed from the body yes every time I have diarrhea I call it a
00:29:00
detox yes that's a natural your body is naturally detoxifying itself I'm detoxing a lot yeah a lot
00:29:10
how are you doing oh I'm good oh my god the other day I forgot why we were talking about this
00:29:17
talking to Corey about like having a really good poop and I was like oh yeah that afterburn
00:29:23
and he was like if you have afterburn you should probably see a doctor and I was like nah
00:29:30
like you have a really good poop in your butthole just feels a little bit hot afterwards do you
00:29:34
know what I'm talking about I think I know what you're talking about like an afterglow it feels good
00:29:40
I mean yeah it's like a buzz yeah when you've had like a solid shit that like scraped everything out
00:29:47
on the way out and it just like stretch your butthole out a little bit then it snapped right back
00:29:52
and then it's like a little bit warm yeah not no idea what I was talking about well I mean
00:29:59
I don't it's so tough because I I sometimes question whether anyone
00:30:05
myself included and but certainly anyone in my like very intimate circle of people has ever
00:30:13
had a healthy shit in our lives and so we all have these like different versions of like what a
00:30:18
good shit feels like and we consistently shock each other and like none of us are on the same page
00:30:25
so yeah I do understand what you're saying and I also understand why he might not
00:30:29
on get what the fuck that means okay you know I'm playing both sides here okay I'm being very
00:30:37
Erica Jane in the Kyle Doree situation okay for a thousand yard stare in the last episode when
00:30:45
she was talking to Doree okay also I know that this has nothing to do with fucking anything but like
00:30:50
can we just talk about how Kyle reading the text at the relaxation party it was a screenshot
00:30:59
of the text and you could see it was all of her pictures at the bottom which is so fucking sus
00:31:04
like tell me you don't want anyone to accidentally scroll through your text with PK without telling me
00:31:10
you don't want anyone like how far up you'd have to scroll like how often you talk to them yes
00:31:16
it was fishy for sure it's so weird and she really is making herself look guilty even if she didn't
00:31:22
do anything untoward like I get it it's a tough situation to be in when you're friends with people
00:31:27
that are going through a separation but like your reaction like you've been on the show for 14
00:31:33
fucking seasons you should know that you're making yourself look bad real bad and like Doree
00:31:40
is really good at making herself look bad so when you're making yourself look worse than Doree
00:31:45
something's off anyway that was my tangent there will be more continue
00:31:51
about detox okay we've hit on a lot so far detoxing body pooping cleansing okay so the notion of
00:32:00
cleansing oneself of unidentified and/or harmful toxins gained a lot of popularity in the 70s like
00:32:08
like health the health form of detoxing yep but purging as a medical practice goes back a long time
00:32:18
okay and you know I got really into this I bet there's ghosts in your blood do cocaine about it
00:32:24
exactly heroic medicine they called it heroic medicine and they started calling it heroic medicine
00:32:31
like later once it became being studied as like a whole okay I think because it was so fucking
00:32:38
intense that you had to be kind of heroic to fucking go through it oh my god yeah also known as heroic
00:32:46
depletion theory advocated for really aggressive bloodletting sweating and purging so that would be
00:32:55
like vomiting and or shitting to shock the body back into health okay so it wasn't just this
00:33:03
humoral medicine so like the four humors yep it's black bile yellow bile blood and pus I think
00:33:12
you love your humors I do love me humors so they would like a back in medieval times treat like way
00:33:19
back they would think that your health was a matter of those four humors being like in harmony with
00:33:26
each other like balanced so if you had a stomach ache for example they would they'd be like oh you
00:33:33
have too much yellow bile we have to you know do some bloodletting okay to balance your humors
00:33:40
back out to get rid of your stomach out so this was that like amped way the fuck up okay so you
00:33:47
would be sweated with a blistering burn agent like something called can thread in okay it was like
00:33:56
a enzyme from stinging beetles so they'd like apply that to your skin so it'd burn your skin and
00:34:03
you'd sweat oh my god this was just one method there were many methods to all of these things but
00:34:09
this is like the severity of the purging uh of the delusion mm-hmm they would also drain
00:34:17
up to 80% of your blood volume how do people survive 80% of their blood volume being drained
00:34:27
lots didn't that tracks I think if you do it slowly enough your body can kind of like regenerate
00:34:34
regenerate but I don't want to actually there's a picture I have on the drive I think it's called
00:34:39
breathing the vein or letting the vein breathe or something like that it's like a medieval
00:34:44
illustration breathing a vein breathing a vein okay this guy does not look like a doctor and
00:34:53
the guy being breathed looks very unhappy I love this painting so fucking much this is absurd
00:35:05
why does the doctor have spurs on his boots I don't know the doctor is in like an orange wig with
00:35:15
like the little rows of curls at the ears he is completely red in the face his mouth is a little
00:35:24
tiny butthole and his eyes are completely wide open with like the whites all the way around it
00:35:30
he's in like a jaunty little outfit but he's standing like very weird and crooked with his feet
00:35:36
sprayed in these little butthole mouth he has the grossest butthole mouth and his boots are giving
00:35:45
pirates of the Caribbean but with like western spurs on the heels for no reason he's holding a
00:35:52
quite lovely ceramic painted bowl and holding up his patient's arm that appears to just have a
00:36:00
hole punched in it at the elbow and a stream of blood is popping out and falling perfectly into
00:36:08
the bowl rapidly filling ceramic bowl yeah while the patient in like a Santa hat is looking away
00:36:17
with his eyes closed and the biggest agonizing frown and wearing Rothy's cloth he is looking like he's
00:36:24
rocking some Rothy's clogs this is absurd and I want to tattoo of it yep I knew you would like that
00:36:31
I love this so that is that's an illustration from that I got when I googled heroic medicine
00:36:40
I am obsessed okay thank you so much you're so welcome I was a gift they would also have you
00:36:50
ingest calamel which is basically mercury oh no to cleanse your intestines y'all we were shooting
00:37:00
in the dark we had no clue and I just said I got my eegd or whatever the fuck yesterday I have photos
00:37:08
of the inside of my intestines I'll pop those on the drive oh hmm do that they're clean yeah I didn't
00:37:14
even have to ingest mercury good for you I also found out that a doctor treated George Washington
00:37:21
in 1799 using heroic medicine so basic what I found out they applied the mercury they he ingested
00:37:30
the mercury and they also did the sweating thing mm-hmm and he died like immediately afterwards
00:37:37
by bitch yeah so attempted the heroic medicine to save George Washington didn't work
00:37:44
didn't work so great the practice of heroic medicine gained favor around 1780 but people
00:37:50
pretty quickly got tired of being dicked around by doctors making them bleed and puke everywhere
00:37:56
yeah like every time I come to see you I leave feeling worse yeah so around like 1850 like 80 years
00:38:05
after that became quite popular people were like maybe like palliative care is better because like
00:38:11
the word care is in that somehow like for some reason these these doc quote-unquote doctors medicine
00:38:21
people were like let's let's strain the body as much as possible without actually killing them
00:38:26
and that will save them it's so wild it's so wild yeah so early it's such like a western medicine
00:38:36
exploration situation too because there had certainly been like holistic practices and like using
00:38:44
medicinal plants and like all of the like wound care and illness treatment like all of these things
00:38:51
did exist with some success among like different indigenous cultures for fucking centuries before we
00:38:59
were like we're gonna take all your blood out well yeah we also went through like the enlightenment
00:39:05
yes so people were like oh academics and new information is where it's at so yeah people were
00:39:12
fumbling around in the dark for a little while not gonna say we aren't still fucking doing that
00:39:18
or we definitely are and I feel like stories like this sometimes give me a little bit of hope because
00:39:24
it's like yeah humanity has been consistently going through rough patches for let's you know forever
00:39:32
and we're still here figuring it out together sometimes in opposition of each other but still
00:39:41
together and sometimes opposition is how we learn not that I'm welcoming the opposition of our
00:39:47
current situation but it's like y'all if humanity can continue to persevere and figure it out through
00:39:56
pouring all your blood into its bloodloft like stay the course stay the course we can do this
00:40:04
god make America blood letting again make America breathe again breathing vain again
00:40:16
hang and bang and brain and hang in the brain and breathe and say yeah new t-shirt okay right
00:40:25
so anyway in the 1970s with like the kind of like all medicine on the rise again this new like
00:40:31
focus on health and wellness people were looking for ways to purify themselves even if they didn't have
00:40:36
access to the cool cool waters of like Minnetonka there it is to rid their bodies of the harmful toxins
00:40:42
prevalent in every day life I'm making this picture my desktop background that's how much I
00:40:47
fucking love it good downloading it right now are you replacing Ken Allen I didn't make him my desktop
00:40:53
which is probably root of me I just have like some generic ass like Mac swooshy color
00:41:00
desktop right now I don't know why I'm just yeah I guess I'm just like devoid of all creativity
00:41:08
but that's about to fucking change bitch okay so during this time several methods of detoxing
00:41:18
we sprung up again in terms of like health health stuff so we have diets the general idea is that
00:41:25
most food contains contaminants that are harmful such as dyes flavor enhancers pea faws fucking
00:41:35
can't even I can detox diets are often high in fiber claiming that then your body will burn off the
00:41:41
toxin storing fat because toxins and shit like that get are you laughing at your desktop
00:41:46
I have to take picture of it it's so absurd I just looked up and you were shaking
00:42:02
the best thing I've ever done I'm so sorry this episode is such a mess
00:42:19
send it send it it's so perfect there's no next the patient looks so
00:42:45
four more this is the fourth time this week okay I swear to god I'll get my shit together
00:42:57
I have to go I'm covering it up with with with my windows because it's so good it's so good
00:43:07
I'll make sure this goes on the drive I'm I'm obsessed best don't tell build seven gold looking like
00:43:20
he never comes in here he will never know he will come again after recording the fixer absolutely
00:43:25
sure I'm going to leave it on and minimize all my windows that he and Ben were working on the
00:43:32
fucking frozen pipe in my office are just gonna be like what the thought it's my office I can do
00:43:41
it's a decor decision bitch I'm an adult I can decorate my office however I choose
00:43:49
this painting is very meaningful to me it changed my life when I found it on google drive last night
00:44:00
okay I've added my desktop make sure to the drive okay that is in fucking credible okay I can focus
00:44:10
now it's cool we got this we're doing great we're doing great Andrea I want you to make the collage
00:44:19
for this episode include both the image itself and the photo of Amanda's desktop oh my fucking god
00:44:31
okay that is so good okay so like toxins can live in your fat or like be stored in your fat for like
00:44:42
sure can months and months if not longer yeah so they say you have a diet that's high in fiber
00:44:51
than your than your body will burn off that fat allowing the contaminants to be processed and
00:44:58
moved out of the body via blood skin urine feces perspiration and expiration all the good
00:45:05
patients all the best patients defecation perspiration expiration defecation no breathing
00:45:15
juice fasting is another type of detox just a PSA any kind of fasting can possibly have dangerous health
00:45:24
consequences so please consult a real life doctor for human beings before embarking on a cleanse
00:45:31
diet fast responsibly y'all yeah colon cleansing this involves the administration of an
00:45:38
enema aka a colonic containing usually I think at least salt because it's like a saline solution
00:45:47
sometimes they put coffee or other herbs in there the coffee animals there was an episode of I
00:45:53
think it was like my strange addiction oh yeah where a couple addicted to coffee and yeah they
00:45:59
were addicted to coffee animals and they were like destroying the tissues in their
00:46:04
but holes and colons yeah because they were doing it like many times a day yeah it's like maybe no
00:46:13
don't be stripping your colon of all of that like important
00:46:17
yeah and bacteria and shit like buy that yeah all your flora and fauna we need our flora and fauna babe
00:46:28
hopefully you don't have fauna in your ass but flora flora bacteria all right that's fair
00:46:34
talk about an afterglow talk about your bubble burning straight up okay so this is said to remove
00:46:41
food you know the stinky brown kind of food from the colon that gets stuck up there sure
00:46:51
here's another PSA the colon typically does not require outside help to clean itself so again
00:46:58
please consult a professional if you want to have an enema probably best to have it administered
00:47:03
by a professional yeah it's like if you have a vagina you want to be cautious of how you clean it
00:47:09
because it's an ecosystem there's important stuff in there that yeah that needs to remain intact
00:47:17
and if you keep stripping it out yep you're gonna you're gonna be hurt yeah yeah speaking to a
00:47:25
licensed professional in any of these areas very important very important don't just google it
00:47:33
find the answer you want and then carry on yeah that usually is not a great option no another kind
00:47:40
of detox is heavy metals aka collation therapy I've heard about this but I don't know what the
00:47:47
fuck this means for a collation therapy yes so this is for the removal of heavy metals from the body
00:47:54
so heavy metal such as mercury lead iron and arsenic hmm some people think that one should also
00:48:03
remove like to like fillings in your teeth because of metal poisoning I don't know how much I don't
00:48:08
know how much there is there but also we don't generally use metal for fillings anymore right well
00:48:14
it depends I mean my fillings are all white well they have a couple yeah there's different
00:48:20
products that they can use now but even like for a long time in modern history that even if there
00:48:26
were like caps or yeah more fillings they were using pretty like safe like gold silver things that
00:48:35
are not gonna like release fucking lead and shit into your mouth yeah yeah that seems like a
00:48:41
little bit of a paranoia to be worried about fillings in like the modern age but certainly that
00:48:50
would have been an issue you know in an early dentistry I would imagine yeah I don't know how valid
00:48:58
that is also like everything it's a fucking spectrum so the end of the day it's all about risk
00:49:04
mitigation if you if this is something you want to be concerned about then do you do you
00:49:10
yep exactly in the 1930s a German chemist was looking for a replacement for citric acid as a
00:49:17
water softener okay so he created a chemical called here we go here we go you got this I believe in
00:49:25
you ethyl and the diamanetetra acetic acid also known as EDTA I think I did pretty good I think you
00:49:38
fucking killed that given that there are back to back a's that was a lot I know don't ask me to
00:49:47
ever do it again I will never collation therapy is actually from what they used it in World War
00:49:55
2 it was invented it was like invented for World War 2 when Oxford scientists were looking for
00:50:00
an antidote to Lewis site which was an arsenic based chemical weapon okay this tracks they had
00:50:08
consistent opportunities to be exposed to dangerous you know heavy metal heavy metals and so this
00:50:17
therapy would have been necessary it wasn't their fillings but like yeah it was like oh we're being
00:50:23
exposed to heavy metals as a means to kill us and it hurt us so we're trying to come up with a
00:50:28
way to pull that out yeah so they heard that EDTA was great for treating lead poisoning so they
00:50:36
came up with this treatment collation therapy some people also think that collation therapy
00:50:42
couldn't be good for treating heart disease but that's kind of an alternative theory the American
00:50:48
Heart Association doesn't recognize it yeah okay is this still like a common practice in modern medicine
00:50:58
or has it like just really evolved since its inception you can get it yeah is that what you're asking
00:51:06
yeah I mean I'm just wondering if this is like still a thing yeah okay I'm pretty positive
00:51:11
it's still a thing and I don't know like how commonly it's practiced but if you are being poisoned
00:51:19
with arsenic like we've talked about several cases in the last year where there was arsenic put
00:51:25
or a talium is another example okay I actually wonder if this is where I actually stumbled upon this
00:51:32
that therapy term like the crazy neighbors with the coke bottles yeah in Florida yeah yeah so if
00:51:39
had they known what it was they could have used this method use collation therapy to trip that yeah
00:51:46
try to detox the body of these heavy metals interesting okay okay I don't know how the therapy
00:51:52
like works no it's like an injection or a transfusion it might be a transfusion I don't really know
00:51:57
I don't know so I'm new with a chemical well yeah and there are different compounds that like
00:52:02
soak up or can latch on they yeah that's what they do they the the chemical the compounds from the
00:52:09
EDTA latch onto the heavy metals and then they are they can be flushed out they're like bigger
00:52:15
they're flood I think they forgot how those were somehow they are like immediately flushed out or
00:52:21
they I don't know they're flushed out they're fuck they're fucking flushed out okay all right great
00:52:26
chemistry occurs you fold it in David I don't know how to make it any clearer you just followed it in
00:52:31
just followed it in so as we kind of touched on there are obviously detox programs that individuals
00:52:36
can enter into as well in order to combat addiction and this goes for pretty much any heavy substance
00:52:44
abuse but alcohol addiction in particular can be uniquely dangerous to detox from because the
00:52:51
withdrawals can cause further harm if not treated and supervised professionally so like you can
00:52:57
die from alcohol withdrawal you can because your body chemistry can literally adjust over time to
00:53:04
rely on that chemical being in your body to function and so things can shut down rapidly when it's
00:53:13
if it's suddenly removed without yes medical supervision and assistance to like ween off and you
00:53:22
know fortunately modern medicine has provided us with access to like a lot of medications and things
00:53:28
for you know removing alcohol not just from like your your diet but also from your body that can
00:53:34
even be taken at home so like there are a lot of different methods I think people hear the word detox
00:53:40
and they just like envision this like rehab rehab people strap to a bed and they're like sick and
00:53:46
dying and like intervention yeah that that can be part of it but like a lot of people people are
00:53:54
commonly detoxing with the help of like their PCP that's prescribing them medications to be able
00:53:59
to ween off of alcohol at home and you know with with some more creature comfort so like there are
00:54:06
lots of there are options and that's part of why like detecting substance use early so that you can
00:54:12
have earlier interventions that are a little bit less traumatic can can be like a really great
00:54:20
opportunity you know to move toward sobriety without as much like harm and trauma both psychologically
00:54:26
but also physically to your body yeah I just think it's important to point out that if this is a
00:54:34
you can have a seizure if you just suddenly cut yourself off from something that your body is used to
00:54:39
consuming and comes to rely on every day so yeah it's it's scary yeah so be careful just be careful
00:54:46
out there be careful out there babes so like I said today I wanted to focus on a specific kind of
00:54:51
detox and that is digital detox oh I love this and I think this is something that we should all be
00:54:58
considering at this particular moment in history yeah man I'm I'm curious about what you find here
00:55:07
because I have like so many thoughts on this okay so most of this information I'm going to tell you
00:55:11
about now comes from the National Institute of Health RIP you had a good run she'll be back glad
00:55:18
I pulled this information before it all went dark so this is from an academic review that was
00:55:24
published by the NIH in April of 2024 about the effects of a digital detox which they define as
00:55:31
when a person or individual stays disconnected from devices or social media for a defined duration
00:55:39
so what I and this okay this is a review it's not it's not one study it's a compendium of comprehensive
00:55:50
research that they did online ironically with similar studies staying within specific parameters
00:55:56
and like mapping out the outcomes of those and then I think they also did their own volunteer based
00:56:02
study okay we're all tried out the like recommended like they tried out the detox basically the like
00:56:08
the social media detox yes and I think it's it's social media but it's also like check in the news
00:56:16
and all that so it's basically any activity you do on your smartphone yeah like doom scrolling
00:56:20
comes in many shapes and sizes yeah they're not saying that you can't like access the internet to like
00:56:26
send an email or like do your work because it's 2025 for fuck's sake yeah we literally can't do
00:56:33
fuck all without the internet anymore yeah this is specifically about mainly social media news
00:56:40
doom scrolling all that stuff so among these parameters here is a list of permissible activities
00:56:46
in the situation of a digital detox as provided by the study so here are some things that you can
00:56:51
you can think about applying to your own life unplugging which is disconnecting from all digital
00:56:57
devices for a certain period so that would be literally taking a breath leaving your TV off
00:57:02
not checking your email another activity time management so set specific times for using and not
00:57:10
using digital devices mindful usage is just being aware of the time and purpose specifically purpose
00:57:17
of using digital devices oh what a concept physical activity engaging in activities like walking
00:57:26
yoga etc to distract from using digital devices you could I need to get a fucking walking pad
00:57:33
because like I walk a lot when the weather is nice but like we've been in a fucking polar vortex
00:57:37
for the last week bitch I'm not going outside yeah I gotta pull mine out it's under my bed
00:57:42
reading books another novel idea spending time reading physical books not ebooks again try to stay
00:57:53
away from the screens and then touch and grasp nature time spending time outdoors away from digital
00:57:59
devices so these are just leisurely things that you could do that don't involve screens or if you are
00:58:08
involving screens being more mindful aware intentional of that time spent yeah I feel like that's
00:58:14
where the the mindful usage is kind of where I fall and like I think this is a really I mean it's
00:58:20
obviously a very relevant topic right now especially with like the brief TikTok ban and the changes
00:58:28
with meta and a lot of people are leaving these platforms and like I do understand that and
00:58:35
there's a lot of like organizing and powerful things that still happen on those platforms and
00:58:43
like the connectivity of the internet that allows people with disabilities to get accurate
00:58:50
and updated information and also like participate in society it's so important so it's just this
00:58:58
thing where it's like we're in this position where you kind of can't live with it can't live without it
00:59:03
or pigeon hold into these because like what is it like six billionaires own like almost every social
00:59:08
media thing that we have access to communication channel yeah not even just social media just doesn't
00:59:16
metal so on like information yeah I think so it's wild and like that same concept applies to the
00:59:22
new my Jeff Bezos owns the Washington Post yeah like it's all the same fucking ball of whatever
00:59:30
PBS PBS news hour yeah that's a good one mm-hmm but that I feel like that reality also kind of
00:59:40
requires us to stay connected and like questioning and giving feedback and like talking to each other
00:59:50
about the shit we're seeing in the news so that we're not just taking in all of this information
00:59:56
and isolation without like the capacity for critical analysis because we're so overwhelmed and
01:00:01
like that's what they fucking want they want us to be so overwhelmed and doom scrolling so hard
01:00:06
that we just shut down and can't fucking function that's the goal yeah in-person community too
01:00:13
it's so important and some people can't I know yeah yeah it's not very egalitarian
01:00:20
no it's like it's part of it mm-hmm and it's not it's not everything because it's not accessible to
01:00:26
everyone so it's yeah it's just like it's what you pointed out is that that critical balance
01:00:31
is so fucking important mm-hmm so this is kind of how the study sort of panned out so I kind of
01:00:39
gave you the parameters mm-hmm and I believe that again this was like a really academic article and
01:00:45
I stared at it for 45 minutes I couldn't just went blank it's been a while since I've read an
01:00:53
article that fucking dense so from what I could tell they did conduct in their own pool of volunteers
01:01:01
they were limited to 30 minutes a day of social media like news you know digital quote-unquote time
01:01:12
okay for 14 days okay so it's not I mean it wasn't a crazy like you're cut off from
01:01:20
the internet for a month yes detox yes so you was a moderation detox 30 minutes a day for 14 days
01:01:27
but that is way way way less time that I spend hell yeah sucking my brain down my phone
01:01:35
well and also like our jobs require us to be pretty plugged in I mean I go beyond my job oh so do I
01:01:44
a thousand percent at first the writers of the article the designers of the study thought
01:01:51
it would be a challenge to find people willing to go all the way through the process and like stick
01:01:56
with it but it turns out this was not the case mm-hmm quote surprisingly both the study team and the
01:02:02
volunteers discovered that a significant number of individuals experience a sense of relief pleasure
01:02:08
and alleviation from the detox process believing it to be less challenging than anticipated it's true
01:02:16
I mean I even think about some of the times that like we've gone on our friend trips with like
01:02:22
Scott and Courtney lordy sorry and we will just kind of intentionally connect with each other
01:02:30
and like go do an activity and like put our phones away the only people I want to talk to are right
01:02:36
in front of me yeah and it really does like when I you know on occasion I will just take a day where
01:02:42
I'm like okay I'm not fucking I can't mm-hmm you know I'll take a peek at the top of the day I'll take
01:02:49
a peek at the bottom and then I'm putting my phone away yeah I want to be like fully facing the real
01:02:55
life interactions in front of me mm-hmm and it does it does feel good good yeah like it makes me feel
01:03:02
more human yeah it like feels your heart a little bit yeah so the majority of those surveyed had
01:03:08
difficulty but we're able to adjust to the 30 minute restriction on the internet showcasing their
01:03:13
capability to adjust their daily habits to accept limited usage of the internet in general respondents
01:03:19
developed a heightened awareness of their online communication patterns and implemented measures
01:03:25
to control their use they're like oh this actually did feel pretty good to disconnect I'm going
01:03:31
to make sure that I keep this up mm-hmm there is like a withdrawal at the top though mm-hmm where
01:03:37
there's that like anxiety of oh my god how many people have tried to call me I haven't checked
01:03:42
my phone like who's texting me you know and I mean some of that is fair like emergencies do happen
01:03:48
and people need to reach you and I think you could still use your phone as a fucking phone right it's
01:03:55
it's the Instagram TikTok Facebook the new Apple news well I'm taking me you're taking my
01:04:03
fucking housewives subreddits from my cold dead hands like I'm sorry it's that's what I'm saying
01:04:10
it's no that's never gonna happen but in terms of like specifically social media this says a
01:04:15
significant number of individuals reported heightened feelings of on Wii so like solitaire like
01:04:21
not not exactly loneliness but just sort of like quiet kind of bummer
01:04:26
solitude bummer solitude feelings yeah this discovery aligns with other research indicating that
01:04:35
diminishing ones engagement with social media specifically does that because it's social we like
01:04:42
to be social we like to know what other people are doing that's human nature yeah that if you're
01:04:46
not activity and if you're not quite used to doing that as much in person to fill your needs
01:04:52
then of course you kind of fill that space with social media and if that's taken away from you
01:04:56
then you're like well I'm all alone and you know social media it's so sinister because it's
01:05:02
literally built to like and you feel bad well yes and it's meant to evoke like dopamine responses
01:05:11
mm-hmm so likes and engagement and like all of that because we just have this in these innate human desires
01:05:20
to be like loved and liked and cared for and it gives you that little flash of it and then like
01:05:28
when you have a post that doesn't do as well it like destroys your soul it's top I mean that's
01:05:37
intentional like it's fucking sinister man it is mm-hmm it really is built that into the
01:05:42
fucking program to have that kind of evocative response so that you will continue to use it chasing
01:05:50
that dopamine high mm-hmm it's crazy it freaks me to fuck out mm-hmm yeah sorry uh orwellian
01:05:59
yes so in conclusion quote the findings suggest that while initial apprehension about the detox
01:06:06
were common many participants found the experience manageable and even enjoyable notably the detox
01:06:11
led to positive changes in addiction and health related outcomes which were maintained post
01:06:18
intervention mm-hmm so people were like oh I'm gonna keep this up wow the review also underscores the
01:06:24
importance of personalized approaches to digital detox like you were saying maybe it's just the more
01:06:30
mindfulness maybe you do need to put your phone in a fucking drawer and leave the house mm-hmm
01:06:36
that's that's what you need personally as well as strategies to manage boredom and substitute
01:06:42
screen time activities reading a book going on a walk playing with your cat I don't know masturbating
01:06:49
I have no idea honestly it like one of the things that I do when I feel so overwhelmed and like
01:06:57
depressed by social media and need to take a break from my screens is like I go to robbie naren's
01:07:03
house mm-hmm and we just sit around and fucking like bitch and shoot the shit and like yeah sometimes
01:07:12
we'll you know we off we watch movies together we fucking rewatch old episodes of drag race like
01:07:18
whatever but we're at least like doing something together together mm-hmm that's like interactive
01:07:25
I mean I don't know that's like they know this so it's I mean it's not like embarrassing but
01:07:30
they're like my safe house like I'll call them and be like I'm stressed and overwhelmed I need to
01:07:34
get the fuck out of my house can I just come over and like work and they're like yeah like I have
01:07:38
the garage code I just don't want to walk in on them like fucking or anything so you know give them a
01:07:42
heads up and that's not because they're gay I don't want to walk in on anybody fucking okay let me
01:07:48
me let me get ahead of that rumor I mean it hates the gays and I do but it's not because they're having
01:07:56
sex with each other this is their mean it's because they're mean to me they didn't like my post on
01:08:03
Instagram no but that really is like such a powerful thing if you know you don't need a ton of
01:08:11
friends like take it from us but I think everybody does need that kind of community and like if we lived
01:08:19
15 minutes apart from each other like Robby and Aaron and I do you'd be on that list too where it's
01:08:25
like you need that little short list of people that you can call and just be like I got to get the
01:08:31
fuck out of here and they're like okay come over or like okay let's go get lunch you know what I mean
01:08:35
like that is so restorative and can be the difference between absolutely falling into the depths of
01:08:41
despair and I think I saw I think it was on the moth but there was some thing I saw recently
01:08:48
I feel like it was from a reputable source it wasn't just a TikTok or something
01:08:52
they said that like a six-minute conversation with a close friend or like someone you love can
01:08:58
be enough to like fulfill you yeah they were saying like it doesn't have to be a full night hang
01:09:07
it doesn't have to be a full meal it doesn't have to be an in-person thing just like if you're
01:09:11
feeling lonely and you need to talk to someone all it takes is six minutes hearing the voice of
01:09:17
somebody who cares about you on the phone can be life-saving yeah so they were saying that like
01:09:24
sometimes when they're feeling lonely or like if they just need to talk to one of their friends
01:09:28
and it doesn't they don't they don't want to they don't want other people to avoid them because
01:09:32
that they they don't want to commit to like a full thing then they'll they'll call their friend
01:09:37
and just say like hey do six minutes and that's kind of their code word for like I really need you
01:09:42
I don't need to take up a lot of your time I just need six minutes of your time I really like that
01:09:47
since we that's really sweet yeah six minutes okay so here is my case for today also related to
01:09:55
digital detox mm-hmm before I start I will say that most of this information came from one source
01:10:03
okay you know what I'll just cover it when we get to it but there wasn't a lot of information
01:10:07
here it is currently still unsolved so keep that in mind okay going back to January 2021
01:10:14
in Port Moody near Vancouver Canada okay so just is paying to picture of this area
01:10:22
it's right on the water with mountains all around it much like you know Vancouver we love Vancouver
01:10:27
sure do it's incredibly pretty it's damp it's bustling it's affluent port moody is a really old
01:10:35
place that was the terminus of the transcontinental railway built by the Canadian Pacific railway
01:10:41
company and historically it was a destination for artists due to the quote ambient lighting oh wow
01:10:50
oh so real I know so it's like kind of this spooky beautiful yeah it's dramatically unscathed
01:10:59
it's twilight it's twilight everyone is glittering skin yeah just everything's covered in moss
01:11:04
everything has like a green glow to it mm-hmm there's a drizzle in the air at all times just gorgeous
01:11:13
Trina Hunt was a 48-year-old woman employed by Shaw Communications and by all accounts
01:11:19
was very well liked by her friends and co-workers so she's 48 years old I believe that she recently
01:11:26
retired early good for her yeah she was last seen by her husband Ian spelled i-a-i-n okay
01:11:36
I just why hey I don't know it looks like Lane yeah Ian on Monday January 18th at 6 a.m he reported
01:11:47
her missing when he came home from work that day the timeline here is very important because it's
01:11:51
basically the crux of this case so I'm gonna read what we know happened chronologically so like I
01:11:58
said most of this came from one source and that source is trina hunt dot com okay so this first
01:12:05
of all extremely well maintained website it's very clean easy to read pictures timeline like
01:12:14
it reads like it reads like a like a Buzzfeed article I'm not trying to diminish the seriousness
01:12:22
of this but like the people who designed this website who keep it up you don't know really
01:12:25
fucking good job yeah like it's expertly curated yes so trina hunt dot com I do also want to point out
01:12:31
because this is unsolved there could be an element of bias in here oh yeah because being
01:12:38
maintained by friends and family mm-hmm but this breaks down the case really really well and there
01:12:43
is not a lot of other information that's available besides the info from this website okay so we're
01:12:50
gonna start on Thursday January 14th Trina is seen on CCTV and this is the last known footage of her
01:12:58
again she's retired so she doesn't go to work so she didn't have to be anywhere on Friday right so
01:13:05
there are people like with immediate red flags going why are you here mm-hmm so Thursday the 14th
01:13:10
that's when she's last seen on CCTV footage Saturday January 16th Ian states that he and Trina
01:13:18
drove to Hope British Columbia to visit a campground they used to go to when they were younger mm-hmm okay
01:13:25
here's an interesting cute okay you do you yeah here's an interesting detail the weather that day
01:13:34
of course because it's port moody was cold foggy and icy okay Ian said they took his gray BMW which
01:13:43
had rear wheel drive instead of taking Trina's larger Mercedes SUV that had all wheel drive okay
01:13:51
interesting choice considering the weather mm-hmm he also said that they didn't have their phones with
01:13:56
them because they were on a digital detox okay this is important yeah see I'm here for a touching
01:14:05
grass digital detox but like anything where I'm expected to engage with the wilderness without
01:14:11
an emergency line I'm not doing it mm-hmm I'm not doing it well and that's not victim blaming that's
01:14:17
just me maybe that's my own fear maybe the digital detox was serving a different purpose yeah that's
01:14:24
what it's sounding like to me so he wasn't sure what time they arrived home but he said it was in
01:14:29
time for a movie so it wasn't super duper late at night okay that same day so this is Saturday around
01:14:35
like in the middle of the day two texts to Trina from a coworker went unanswered so her phone was
01:14:43
still existing she her phone received two texts she did not answer she's retired so this is like
01:14:49
a former coworker yeah not someone who was like a coworker who's like expecting her to be at work
01:14:55
I think it's a former coworker because they it they made it pretty clear that like she was good
01:15:00
she still remained friends with her coworkers yep she's very well liked I think it was just a friend
01:15:06
Sunday January 17th Ian states it was a quiet Sunday nobody knows what if anything really happened
01:15:11
that day Trina's phone had answered some texts that day but the style in which they were written was
01:15:18
very curt they didn't have any emojis which was unlike her so people were worried getting kind of
01:15:26
worried I would so know if it was like not you texting like immediately yeah so I totally trust this
01:15:37
kind of shit like a friend fucking knows I talked to you constantly I know I can hear everything you
01:15:45
write in the exact cadence of your fucking voice I would know if it wasn't you yeah there's no way
01:15:51
yeah so this was the response that someone got from Trina's phone quote delayed response because I'm
01:15:59
trying a digital detox this weekend haven't touched the phone all weekend okay two weekends in a
01:16:07
row Trina so clicks careless no emojis and then the friend set replies something like wow a digital
01:16:15
detox like that sounds really impressive to which Trina's phone replies amen and the friend was like
01:16:22
just use that's not like you've never said anything like that before yeah no emojis like weird
01:16:29
punctuation just weird so when asked about Sunday evening Ian states that he did he purposely did not
01:16:37
set the house alarm that evening because he was gonna leave for work early on Monday and didn't
01:16:42
want to wake up Trina okay can't you just turn off the alarm yeah this feels like a lot of
01:16:49
gymnastics to make pieces fit mm-hmm evidently Trina was very facetious about setting the alarm
01:16:56
and having the windows shut in the doors locked at night good for her mm-hmm so it was weird that he
01:17:02
purposely didn't set the alarm and that she also didn't insist that he set the alarm right like
01:17:09
just because I'm on digital detoxes I mean we're gonna completely fuck over my entire routine yeah
01:17:14
so Monday January 18th there is no activity on Trina's phone she misses an appointment that she
01:17:19
had at 1 p.m. I don't know if it was like a hair appointment or some kind of appointment mm-hmm
01:17:23
Ian comes home at 4.30 he sees Trina's car in the driveway her keys her wallet and her phone
01:17:29
are there but Trina is not there interesting so at 5 p.m. he calls the police to report her missing
01:17:36
that evening the port moody police began canvassing the area and the following couple days
01:17:41
see the involvement of the police search and rescue workers people in the community
01:17:45
helicopter and canine units and a marine unit all looking for her okay so the search is
01:17:52
extensive they're taking this seriously very seriously a month later on February 17th
01:17:59
there's a news report a news press release by the port moody police they still have not
01:18:05
months she's been missing for a month they have a press release without yeah that's kind of
01:18:10
fucking wild I'm sure they released something before but this is a press release that said
01:18:16
yeah it lists all the agencies working to find Trina and also said we have also contacted our partners
01:18:24
at the integrated homicide investigation team called iHit as part of that team's mandate is to
01:18:31
investigate suspicious missing person cases where foul play is suspected I jumped the gun the press
01:18:37
releases more to be like we're moving this case toward a homicide investigation at this time evidence
01:18:44
indicates that this missing person case does not meet iHit's mandate so here's what happened
01:18:50
port moody police chief flugal I don't I didn't get his first name chief flugal was confident that
01:18:57
something fucked up was going on like people are acting weird we can't find her I'm gonna move this
01:19:03
up to iHit because I'm pretty fucking sure there's foul play that's that's what police chief says
01:19:09
iHit says no we don't have enough evidence okay so flugal remains confident that something's up
01:19:15
something's fucked up we got to this this isn't right something's off some's off but the official
01:19:21
agency doesn't doesn't they're not going to take it on yet yeah okay okay march first Trina's
01:19:26
family and friends are still making banners to fly on overpasses appealing to the public for any
01:19:31
information Ian does not participate in any of these activities but does release a particularly
01:19:38
bland statement to the press which reads the past six weeks since Trina's disappearance have been
01:19:45
a devastating and incredibly difficult time for me and everyone who knows my wife I feel the same
01:19:50
frustration and incomprehension that her parents family and friends share in not knowing what has
01:19:56
happened to Trina I'm confident that police are doing all they can to solve this case and I am hopeful
01:20:01
that they will bring Trina home it's giving what's his face who killed his watts crystals yeah
01:20:10
shenan in the kids yeah just doesn't care it's just like a boilerplate message it's just nothing
01:20:16
yeah there are are also photos of him on the drive he just looks like a shitty white dude that's him
01:20:23
shitty fucking white dude yeah he looks like the fucking chuckle fuck who said your body my choice
01:20:29
because that's exactly what he looks like thin lips so like where is where are your lips it just
01:20:36
looks like I can't talk I am not one to talk but girl you have a thousand times more lip than this
01:20:44
fucking asshole does men with no lips just really fucking it's very strange it's weird it's unsettling
01:20:51
he's also got a bunch in which I often admire but not on this guy not on this guy it it looks like
01:20:59
I don't like him I don't like him at all so this part's really weird and I don't have any further
01:21:05
information but it's a weird tidbit oh god okay on March 10th so this is just nine days after he
01:21:14
released his statement his stupid ass statement yeah this is nothing sandwich yeah Ian's tenure
01:21:22
as CEO of clean tech service group is terminated okay Ian's the CEO at whatever clean tech service
01:21:31
group is boo he says he's taking a sabbatical he's like oh I'm just stepping aside for a little bit
01:21:37
but that's not proven all we know is that he doesn't have his job anymore and we also know that
01:21:42
clean tech has scrubbed Ian off of all public facing materials you did something fucked up they
01:21:49
are distancing themselves from you mm-hmm isn't that weird that's really fucking weird
01:21:55
March 29th because especially for like a corporation not to protect their seat like a CEO
01:22:03
asset something happened you've done something beyond mm-hmm on March 29th a set of human remains
01:22:12
is found in hope where they went to their childhood campground oh fuck it wasn't at the campground
01:22:20
I don't think it says it was just south of silver creek the day the remains were reported
01:22:25
Ian leaves the home that he's sharing with missing Trina to move in with his parents in mission British
01:22:33
Columbia okay the day the day the day the day the day the remains are reported huh two days later
01:22:42
March 31st a second set of remains is found in hope again the town where their camp they
01:22:49
went and visited that campground allegedly do they think and we maybe we don't know do these remains
01:22:55
all belong to the same person set three sets of people sorry two set there's there's two different
01:23:03
people oh wow they're two totally different bodies oh my god okay both of these bodies were proven
01:23:10
not to be those of several missing people in the area uh-huh so they they had a list of missing
01:23:17
people they are comparing said missing people to the bodies and their ruling they are actively ruling
01:23:25
not all of them but they are ruling a lot of them out so they were they're attempting to they're
01:23:30
comparing the bodies against missing people including Trina yeah but they're ruling certain people
01:23:35
out on April 1st the next day a police car and another detective were seen at the hunts house
01:23:42
of course Ian is not there he's at his parent's house uh-huh conveniently
01:23:46
April 6th just a few days later a third set of human remains was found this time in mission
01:23:53
where Ian's parents lived that body was identified to belong to Brandon Sackabo age 23 from Saskatchewan
01:24:03
okay again this information is just what we know happened
01:24:08
as we sit right now things have not been tied together okay so we don't know if or how this person
01:24:14
is connected to this dude they they identified the body that was found in mission which
01:24:21
coincidentally is where Ian was staying with his parents as far as we know now that is a coincidence
01:24:27
but then we have these other two bodies in hope where they had been on Saturday two days before
01:24:33
she was reported missing two days after she had last been seen yeah it's not looking great I know
01:24:39
coincidences happen god knows we could all be within a few miles of the human remains at any given
01:24:46
time and just have no idea like that is just the reality mm-hmm but this is like really weird it's
01:24:54
weird so by April 18th four months have gone by Trina's friends and family hold a candle light
01:25:00
vigil Ian does not attend good luck guy yeah that's that's us and then on May 1st I hit reports
01:25:12
that the human remains found in hope the first set of remains that were south of silver creek are
01:25:18
those of Trina hunt oh no so that first body they found was her oh so foul play is finally suspected
01:25:28
yeah chief flugal is vindicated yeah justice for flugal yeah for flugal the media and flowers start
01:25:36
showing up around the hunt house but of course Ian is not even there three fucking days later
01:25:42
after that body has been identified as his missing wife mm-hmm he and his father arrive at the house
01:25:49
stay one night and then leave the next day with a bunch of his clothes so obviously rumors are
01:25:55
beginning to swirl but the authorities confirm nothing and I don't want like obviously everybody
01:26:02
greaves differently I'm biased because this is like a Tucker Carlson mascot looking white dude
01:26:10
but life looks awful optics in these kinds of situations historically have fucking mattered
01:26:18
and if you don't if you're what if you've discovered your wife has been missing for months and now
01:26:24
it's confirmed that she's dead and is part of a murder investigation mm-hmm if you are not like
01:26:30
having some kind of reaction to that mm-hmm human reaction it's giving it's ringing alarm bells
01:26:38
that's just like that's just is what it is yeah it's not enough to convict you but like it's
01:26:43
enough to be like why do you seem to not give a shit about this mm-hmm it's it's your fucking life
01:26:50
dreamy fishy it's suspicious it's weird so on June 1st Trina's family announces a $50,000
01:26:58
uh Canadian reward for information leading to an arrest okay just four days later on June 5th
01:27:05
I hit and port moody police conduct simultaneous searches of both Trina and Ian's house
01:27:11
and Ian's parents house good police were seen conducting forensic 3D scanning like checking the yard
01:27:20
round yeah gathering male removing objects etc both the BMW and the Mercedes SUV were towed away
01:27:28
almost exactly one year later my god this has been going on for so long so this is like a year and
01:27:35
five months after she disappeared on June 3rd 2020 Ian Hunt is arrested from the house he shared
01:27:42
with Trina oh my god apparently he still had slippers on it was Friday the next day he's fucking
01:27:50
released mm-hmm and that clearly not enough to hold him that's the timeline so far that is everything
01:27:57
that has happened so far the killer has not brought to justice we don't know who the the other
01:28:05
body belonged to that that second one oh my god the cops aren't saying anything probably because
01:28:11
they don't feel like appealing to the public will be helpful I think the cops know that he did it
01:28:17
but maybe what after his arrest when it came time to prove that to some sort of court system
01:28:25
the court was like no you don't have enough and they have released him and you know it
01:28:30
it doesn't do any service to Trina for the public to assume things that aren't correct like
01:28:40
the other bodies very well may have nothing to do with this guy do I think he
01:28:46
participated in killing his wife yeah kind of based on what we have but like I don't know about
01:28:53
these other remains that were found and we're just going to have to wait until more evidence is
01:28:59
uncovered but that is fucking wild yeah so this case is still very much in the public eye the
01:29:05
reward has been renewed and there is a particularly damning statement from the family which I will
01:29:11
read now in hunt and his family are consistently conspicuous in their absence in helping search for
01:29:17
Trina or for Trina's killer other than a couple of impotent statements written by Ian and read out
01:29:23
by Trina's family over the last year yeah you'd think your husband would be fucking doing everything
01:29:29
he possibly could to get justice for the death of his wife the murder of his wife and if you're
01:29:35
not doing that I'm looking at you weird uh-huh Ian Hunt and his family have not contributed
01:29:41
towards the reward they have not and refused to commit any finances nor time nor provide any
01:29:47
more encouragement effort nor exposure he's got money he was a CEO to help track down Trina's killer
01:29:54
and help provide closure Ian and his family silence and weak action is deeply noted by all her
01:30:00
friends and most importantly the memory and family of Trina the money thing is particularly
01:30:06
egregious because that is like so the bare minimum of what he could have been doing just to
01:30:13
at face value look like he gave a shit yeah and he didn't even do that yeah so uh yeah
01:30:19
trinahunt.com check that out it's fascinating if you have any information contact the port moody
01:30:26
police specifically flugal yep and yeah let's try to bring justice for Trina I think it would be hard
01:30:34
to it would be it'd be difficult to prove that the guy didn't do it but like man that guy sucks
01:30:42
and we have to find her killer yeah I'm very I'm definitely gonna set like an alert for her name
01:30:49
because there is so there they know a lot like they have a lot of solid information but there is so
01:30:55
much we don't know and we'll I mean this seems to be a little bit of a trend with Molly's fan
01:31:01
pick cases because we're about to get into mind but like when they're in the process of investigations
01:31:06
like this there's so much they can't release for like the integrity of the case so I imagine if
01:31:12
this especially if this goes to court like goes to trial there will be so much more that we find
01:31:17
about this but like I do I hate how long it takes and I do appreciate that if the investigators are
01:31:24
doing their jobs and like I don't know what they would call it in Canada but like if the state
01:31:29
prosecutor is doing their job in compiling something really comprehensive so they have a solid case
01:31:35
so that they can actually like bring this fucking thing to a conclusion then like our patience is
01:31:42
an important part of that but yeah if someone I mean God willing if someone listening to this like
01:31:47
knows anything like please share that fucking information so that this poor woman's family can
01:31:53
get some god damn justice and fucking sleep yep so yeah uh uh uh well done digital detox
01:32:01
she was on digital detox no that shady as hell uh huh yeah damn well done great suggestion Molly yeah
01:32:11
thanks Molly all right let's take a quick break to hear a word from our sponsors and then get into
01:32:16
Molly's other fan pick case let's do that I am Chris get there and I'm very excited to tell you
01:32:23
about beautiful anonymous a podcast where I talk to random people on the phone I tweet out a phone
01:32:27
number thousands of people try to call talk to one of them they stay anonymous I can't hang up that's
01:32:32
all the rules I never know what's gonna happen we get serious ones I've talked with meth dealers on
01:32:37
their way to prison I've talked to people who survived mass shootings crazy funny ones I talked
01:32:42
to a guy with a goose laugh somebody who dresses up as a pirate on the weekends I never know what's
01:32:46
gonna happen it's a great show subscribe today beautiful anonymous anyway we're back we're back
01:32:54
and I have been graced with the other fan pick this week similarly to Lucy I need to note that
01:33:00
this case is very recent more information will come out about this in the coming year I'm hoping
01:33:06
I'm gonna be real with you this was hard to research because the trials haven't begun yet so
01:33:12
like we said a lot of information isn't released until it comes out at trial for like protecting
01:33:17
the integrity of the case choosing a jury and patience is important and patience is important but
01:33:22
like here is everything I could gather that is available so far so doctor Hamid Mirchujai was a
01:33:29
respected physician in Woodland Hills California specializing in detox he was well liked by his
01:33:36
patients in his community and reportedly served thousands of average Americans and celebrities alike
01:33:42
struggling with addiction he had over 10 years of experience in the field of addictionology and
01:33:47
approach the specialty with an open mind he used standard procedures as well as holistic
01:33:52
procedures depending on the needs of the client like it's also it's California he was woodland hills
01:33:57
is like near Topanga it's like this is a very common approach to like west coast affluent rehabilitation
01:34:06
is like yeah it's very blended between standard western medicine practices and like health and wellness
01:34:14
there was like one thing I read that insinuated that some of his practices could have been seen as
01:34:21
controversial but I'm not substantiating that and I think that that's out there because of the fact
01:34:28
that we don't have all of the details in this case and so people are are most thirsty to understand
01:34:35
what the motive for this was and we'll kind of get to it but like that just feels like a big reach
01:34:42
to me that that would that his practices when like I looked at his website I looked up his reviews
01:34:49
like there was nothing that I could find that could corroborate or even like show a glimmer of that
01:34:57
suggestions yeah so the only reason I'm even saying it is because if that's something that you come
01:35:04
across in the very limited information that's out about this case I I would encourage you to take
01:35:10
it with a grain of salt because we don't know what the fuck the motivation was at this point
01:35:14
we can kind of gather what it was but like we won't know until trial and even then maybe not maybe not
01:35:23
unfortunately as you notice we're talking about him in the past tense he was fatally shot on Friday
01:35:29
August 23rd of 2024 in the parking lot of his clinic as he was leaving for the day according to
01:35:35
the LAPD this was not a random act of violence but a targeted attack surveillance footage showed a
01:35:42
masked suspect creeping around the clinics parking lot kind of hiding like lying in weight essentially
01:35:50
for nearly an hour oh god waiting for Dr. Merchagy to exit the building as the doctor approached
01:35:57
his car at around 615 pm the suspect fired multiple shots and at least one at like pretty close
01:36:07
range killing him and fled on foot I don't think the doctor was the last person to leave
01:36:15
the clinic so the gunshots were heard 911 was called immediately paramedics from the LA
01:36:23
fire department arrived very quickly but it was unfortunately too late and Dr. Merchagy was
01:36:31
pronounced dead at the scene was he shot multiple times I don't know I believe so but there were
01:36:38
certainly rounds that were collected at the scene that had not passed through him or made contact
01:36:46
with him but again the details are kind of limited because like even all of that is evidence that
01:36:55
they're using to build toward the trial for this person and additional persons involved in this case
01:37:03
it's a lot more complicated than it seems on the surface because there's like multiple people
01:37:09
that have their fucking sticky little goddamn fingers in this situation okay so as it turns out
01:37:15
Dr. Hambida Merchagy had a tumultuous relationship with his ex-wife Ahong Merchagy
01:37:22
who previously worked at the clinic I think in some sort of like administrative capacity she
01:37:27
wasn't a doctor the two divorce in 2010 and they had a well like it was a messy divorce and messy
01:37:36
lead up to the divorce I had a well documented history of hostility financial disputes violence
01:37:42
mutual accusations of harm and wrongdoing I honestly don't know much about him or his
01:37:50
role in a lot of this a lot is coming out about her and there are reports that he made of things
01:38:00
that she had done leading up to this so I'm like intimate partner abuse types of yes and so I'm not
01:38:09
saying that he never participated in that because I don't know but there isn't much that I could find
01:38:17
that is documented at least to suggest that now we know that a lot of people do not report incidents
01:38:23
of intimate partner violence so I'm not saying that this guy is like nobody no victim is perfect
01:38:29
but what I'm saying is I don't know and so there's not going to be some sort of like smear campaign
01:38:36
about this man because we just don't I don't have any evidence to support that he was like
01:38:41
consistently violent toward his wife one of these accusations was from Dr. Merchagy
01:38:49
who reported that a hung had been working in an administrative position at the clinic before
01:38:54
their divorce and he agreed to keep her on after they split like trying to be amicable like
01:39:01
I know we're divorced but I'm not gonna like fire you from your job just because we're breaking up
01:39:04
but then six years after their divorce in 2016 Dr. Merchagy discovered that she was allegedly
01:39:11
embezzling large sums of money from the clinic so he fired her and she allegedly retaliated by
01:39:18
threatening to destroy the clinic and then engage in a series of disruptive actions including
01:39:24
breaking into the clinic multiple times like after hours and at least one documented physical
01:39:31
assault against him one report alleged that she had him physically assaulted by three men wielding
01:39:37
baseball bats and she's still working at his clinic and she had just been fired oh this was all
01:39:43
after he had just fired her so he's like caught her allegedly embezzling he fires her she is retaliating
01:39:50
now okay and so she but so so he's attacked by these like random dudes at baseball bats these goons
01:39:58
yeah then she claims that he the doctor was threatening her life and had once gone as far as to
01:40:06
draw a hunting knife on her during an argument so again that that accusation like the baseball bat
01:40:12
thing is substantiated like we know that happened the hunting knife thing doesn't seem to be substantiated
01:40:18
we're not sure Dr. Merchagy did report threats from awang's new fiance there's nothing I could find
01:40:25
that indicated who this fiance is or that he has any connection to Dr. Merchagy's murder or the
01:40:31
baseball bat attacks I that was just like suck our report he made I don't know if that is even relevant
01:40:37
to the case at the end of the day and a deep detailed violent altercations in which he feared for his
01:40:42
safety and again I believe this may have been the baseball bat incident but details are super spotty
01:40:48
because this case hasn't officially gone to trial so a lot is going to come up as the trials begin
01:40:53
and there could have been multiple attacks on him leading up to his murder that we don't have
01:40:58
public access now to because that is all relevant information to escalating behavior that led to his
01:41:04
death so it's kind of a tough spot that we're in right now trying to follow this case because there's
01:41:09
so much that we don't have access to because we haven't got a trial yet so what we do know is that
01:41:15
enough evidence to support the theory of a murder for higher plot orchestrated by awang has led to five
01:41:21
arrests so his ex-wife awang has been arrested a man named Evan Hardman who was identified as the
01:41:27
shooter from the parking lot sarah jawad who allegedly facilitated the crime and helped hardman
01:41:34
flee the state he was arrested in Texas while the other suspects were all arrested in California
01:41:39
I don't know if he even lived in California because some of the reports I read refer to him as a
01:41:45
Texas man so he may have been friends with her and come to the state to do this and then
01:41:51
left and went back but again I'm not 100% sure we don't have that detail a man named Sean
01:41:57
Randall for helping orchestrate the attack and a woman named Ashley Rose sweeting who was accused
01:42:02
of acting as an accessory by driving hardman to and from the scene hardman and jawad were also
01:42:08
implicated in the baseball bat assault on dr. mershagye last year so there is a connection there
01:42:15
again the exact evidence found that identified these five suspects has not yet been made public but
01:42:21
what is assumed is the prior incidents involving awang and her cohorts as well as awang's
01:42:27
relationship with dr. mershagye and potential motive he's accused her of embezzling they had a
01:42:35
messy divorce there's definitely motive there yeah as well as surveillance footage and forensics
01:42:40
at the scene like fingerprints DNA ballistics evidence and digital forensics like phone records emails
01:42:47
text search history social media activity literally every piece of tech we use to communicate
01:42:51
leaves a trace and they're they're scouring all of it led them to believe that these five were
01:42:55
working together in service of awang's murder plot there was certainly enough evidence to give
01:43:00
investigators a warrant to raid her home during the raid on awang mershagye's residence in calibassus
01:43:07
law enforcement officials conducted a thorough search together evidence again while specific details
01:43:12
about the item sees have not been publicly disclosed these operations are fairly standard and typically
01:43:17
aimed on cover digital communications phones computers tablets seized financial records both
01:43:23
physical and digital we're talking receipts screenshots timelines and everything at fucking
01:43:30
everything and in this case they'd especially be looking for any receipts indicating payments
01:43:35
to her accomplices to support the word of her higher charges physical evidence weapons clothing
01:43:40
warned during the crime shoes that match footprint forensics hair fibers that are consistent with
01:43:45
evidence collected at the scene etc like they they just went top to bottom in this house and they're
01:43:49
trying to comb everything that's wild i and so i don't know how they do that collecting the trace
01:43:55
evidence like that it's so incredible what blows my mind is this other category of evidence that they
01:44:03
try to look for which is associative materials basically that's what i meant yeah but that's not
01:44:09
that's not even the trace evidence that's not like hair fibers like that's not that kind of stuff
01:44:14
this is like anything and everything that doesn't fall into the above categories but indicates a
01:44:20
connection to the crime and the other individuals involved in the case so like as a totally random
01:44:25
example say you're doing a raid on a home and there's like a membership card for a gym and it's
01:44:32
the same gym that one of the other suspects belongs to that's associative materials there's a year
01:44:39
book in the house where they're both pictured they went to the same school that's a connection that's
01:44:44
associative materials cool like it's like what don't you grab you know like they both subscribe to
01:44:51
this magazine like what what do you deem associative it's you have to grab everything you have to be
01:44:56
really creative about it too like you're basically like weaving stories developing theories on the spot
01:45:02
about like what could be connected to what right which obviously leaves room for bias human error
01:45:09
all so many things but it's like of course that was that was a fascinating I like didn't
01:45:14
even think about that as part of these like evidence collection raids I'm writing this down
01:45:20
yeah future topic associative materials so investigators clearly found what they needed because
01:45:25
the raid was a significant component of a hung merchandise arrest on charges of orchestrating
01:45:30
the murder given the ongoing nature of the investigation and legal proceedings detailed
01:45:34
information about the evidence collected during the raid remains confidential and it is that is
01:45:39
very standard such details are typically withheld to preserve the integrity of the case and
01:45:43
ensure a fair trial so let's break down the charges that these folks are looking at and I am
01:45:48
avi not a lawyer so I got this breakdown for the law what I know that was my big reveal of 2025
01:45:56
I'm so sorry for lying to you all for all these years so I got this breakdown most of the rest of
01:46:01
what I'm going to go over is from a law firm blogging about the case I don't think that they have
01:46:06
direct involvement in the case but they're also in California and they're just following it very
01:46:09
closely so shout out to Brian Fagan who basically has blah blah blah blah blah that I got this
01:46:17
information from so a hung merchandise his ex wife she's 53 years old she is charged with murder
01:46:23
investigators believe she orchestrated the plot driven by years of animosity financial disputes
01:46:28
and unresolved grievances stemming from their contentious 2010 divorce more over they all led
01:46:34
that she hired individuals to execute the attack and potentially provided logistical support
01:46:39
considering the depth of their legal and personal history investigators view her involvement
01:46:43
as the cornerstone of the conspiracy now I think she will get more charges I think this is just
01:46:49
the charge that they had enough evidence to hold her and and get the process started to take her
01:46:55
to trial but considering the fact that I think there's going to be conspiracy to commit murder I think
01:47:01
she's looking at she's looking at murder but not in the first degree because she like didn't actually
01:47:06
pull the trigger there's going to be a whole mess of charges that are going to come out with malice
01:47:12
yep yep so but for now it's like we got her from murder we're able to hold her she's going to be
01:47:18
going to trial Sean Randolph he's 46 years old he faces murder charges as well accused of being a
01:47:24
key collaborator in the planning and execution of the plot authorities have not fully detailed
01:47:28
his exact role but his arrest alongside a hung strongly suggests a high level of involvement
01:47:34
additionally investigators believe he may have played a key part in coordinating the logistics or
01:47:38
connecting other conspirators so he could have been the window to these other friends that were
01:47:44
willing to carry this out the gateway gal and I think he had been involved in the baseball bat incident
01:47:52
so this is like a repeat situation Evan Hardman 41 he's the guy who
01:47:57
fired the gun as far as we know authorities have charged Hardman with murder and special
01:48:03
with special circumstances believing that he is the individual who pulled the trigger
01:48:08
moreover this accusation underscores his central role in the crime surveillance footage
01:48:12
and eyewitness accounts reportedly placed him at the scene of the crime where he ambushed
01:48:16
Dr. Merchagy as he was leaving his clinic the special circumstances charge indicates pre-meditation
01:48:22
and may suggest financial incentives tied to the murder for higher scheme so that's her going
01:48:28
I'll give you X thousand dollars if you kill my husband those the special circumstances and we
01:48:33
don't know how a hung nose uh Sean or any of these people at this point not quite yet
01:48:40
I did I specifically searched to be like were any of these people her fiance because I saw
01:48:46
that thing about the fiance her new fiance threatening him yeah and it there was nothing nothing that
01:48:54
would indicate that she was engaged or like sexually involved with any of these people I feel like
01:49:00
what it looks like to me is that she had a personal relationship with Sean Randolph and had like
01:49:06
disclosed information to him about the troubles in her marriage again I'm speculating wildly but
01:49:12
this is like what it looks like to me because he connect well maybe connected her to everyone else I
01:49:17
I that's that's what the police or the investigation is saying and that's what I understand to be true
01:49:23
with the limited information that I have and if he was connected to the baseball bat incident
01:49:28
then they'd have a history of like her reaching out to him and being like you go fuck up my husband
01:49:33
and then it's like well I didn't get what I wanted when you guys just beat him up let's
01:49:38
fucking kill yeah that's not what I meant it shows like a clear line of communication that led to
01:49:44
escalating behavior that brings us here now it just makes sense that like this guy is a key
01:49:48
component to how we fucking got here Sarah La Jouette she's 26 the youngest of the crew I'm very
01:49:55
curious how 26 yeah I'm very curious how to find out how she got wrapped up in all of this wow
01:50:01
authorities have charged her with murder with special circumstances suspecting that um oh sorry
01:50:06
this is a this is a man I am so sorry about that my bad Sarah La Jouette is a man not a woman that's on
01:50:14
me I should have looked at that more meticulously but there aren't even like photos of all the suspects
01:50:19
that I could across reference so I was just reading names through a western lens that's my bad
01:50:24
but authorities have charged him with murder with special circumstances suspecting that he played
01:50:28
a critical role in facilitating the murder furthermore his alleged involvement highlights his
01:50:32
significant contribution to the execution of the crime I think I again I'm so curious how this like
01:50:38
young 26 year old yeah 20 fucking six got wrapped up in this what like logistics maybe he was
01:50:46
contributing to there's so much that's gonna come out at these trials that I'm very curious about
01:50:51
and then Ashley Rose tweeting she's 40 and authorities have charged her with accessory to murder
01:50:56
accusing her of driving hard men the shooter to and from the crime scene by providing his direct
01:51:01
logistical support she allegedly played a key role in executing the plot consequently her actions
01:51:06
firmly link her to the conspiracy so there's obviously a lot of evidence that she was also involved
01:51:12
yeah there's so many people involved in this yeah like enough that they've already been arrested
01:51:18
and charged yeah yeah and this just happened in August so it's like there was obviously compelling
01:51:23
evidence that they were quickly able to make arrests dang prosecutors are requesting that both
01:51:29
Evan Hardman the shooter and Sarah Law Jawed the 26 year old remain held without bail citing
01:51:34
their direct involvement in the crime they argue that releasing either suspect poses significant
01:51:38
risks such as potential flight or harm to others jail records confirm that authorities are holding
01:51:44
Jawed without bail although his specific location remains on disclose meanwhile Hardman does not
01:51:49
appear in the records adding uncertainty about his custody status however his absence aligns with
01:51:55
the high likelihood that he too is being held without bail due to his alleged central role in the murder
01:52:00
and it's probably also at an undisclosed location they keep some so much of this very buttoned up
01:52:05
and I think that they're expecting this to be a really high profile case which will affect jury
01:52:10
selection so they have to be so fucking careful this is like a well-known doctor in California that
01:52:18
like treated all these celebrities in fucking detox I guess I didn't really know that that they could
01:52:25
just like not have people like inmates registered publicly like you can just disappear people that
01:52:32
mean yeah it's it's creepy because that could easily be a tactic that's abuse and I also kind of
01:52:39
get it because it's like you don't want press and a lot of you know fucking podcasters like citizen
01:52:47
detectives reaching out to these people and extracting potentially harmful incorrect problematic
01:52:54
information before there's even been a trial date set or any kind of jury selection that could
01:52:59
influence the public like I get it I get it it's just it's just creepy yeah it's really creepy
01:53:05
very it's I know there's a blurred line between that for everyone's protection and well we don't
01:53:13
know where they are yep I mean people know where they are but like it's not it's just not it's not
01:53:18
public information yeah I'm spiraling about the new administration just disappearing people oh yeah
01:53:24
it's that's super fair and very very real and very scary yeah Ashley Rose tweeting was accused of
01:53:31
driving hard men to and from the crime scene and she faces accessory to murder charges prosecutors
01:53:36
initially requested a one million dollar bail for her emphasizing the substantial amount as a
01:53:42
reflection of her critical role in the crimes logistics despite this jail records show that she is
01:53:47
now being held without bail at the century regional detention center notably tweeting has entered a
01:53:51
plea of not guilty and is set to appear in court again on December 24th that was when this was written
01:53:57
this court date may have been delayed a lot of this has been so that's kind of unclear I don't know if
01:54:02
she's like had her first court appearance yet what kind of get to that authorities are currently
01:54:06
holding a Hongmarshagai and mr. Randolph without bail and they plan to present their cases to the
01:54:13
Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office very soon meanwhile the involvement of multiple
01:54:18
individuals and the intricate nature of the alleged plot continue to raise questions about the
01:54:22
underlying motives which investigators are still examining it's easy for us on the surface to like
01:54:28
get this information read Bob Loblaws Loblog and go oh yeah of course she would have motive to kill him
01:54:34
they had a messy divorce she was embezzling money but like there's gonna be more and we just don't
01:54:40
fucking know we don't know until we know and you don't know how or who or when or real why really
01:54:46
yeah until all of it comes out and I hope it fucking does further more officials have not yet
01:54:53
disclosed how the suspects are linked or the specific roles each allegedly played in the crime we're
01:54:58
only getting the very like baseline this was the shooter this was a driver these are co-conspirators
01:55:05
we haven't released how they know each other like we have that information but we're sitting on it
01:55:10
until trial as of now a specific trial date for the individuals accused in the murder of Dr. Humid
01:55:17
Mershagai has not been set the legal proceedings are still in the preliminary stages the arrangement
01:55:22
for a hung Mershagai was the ex-wife was initially scheduled for December 16th 2024 but was postponed
01:55:30
to insurrection day January 6th 2025 but recent reports indicate that the arrangement
01:55:35
had been further delayed and now a new date hasn't been announced so like this is legitimately
01:55:40
happening right the fuck now we know that delays like this are not uncommon in this case seems
01:55:46
to have a lot of people involved which means a lot of evidence to come through and prepare for both
01:55:52
the prosecution and the defense yeah a lot of coordination from all these attorneys to oh yeah
01:55:58
and it doesn't I haven't seen anything that indicates that they will be tried together so we could
01:56:04
be watching this unfold with five different trials or five different people for years I mean
01:56:11
oh my god there's no telling how long this could take but one place you can get like reliable
01:56:16
ongoing updates would be the Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office website because they're
01:56:21
handling the court side of this case so like if you are interested in following it I sure
01:56:28
is shit I'm gonna be keeping an eye on it because it's very weird and I'm very curious like what's
01:56:33
going to come out about all of this but uh that would be my recommendation is to just keep tabs on
01:56:40
the LA District Attorney's Office for updates on this case google alerts for both of these cases
01:56:48
seriously Molly you're giving us things we love which is like speculation and discussion but things
01:56:53
we hate which is like no beautiful wrap up it is it's hard to write cases like this because we're
01:57:02
used to going like way back into the archives where there's so much information even if it's not
01:57:07
a super popular case it's been covered a million times and so I mean I've got like a bunch of
01:57:12
different articles that just kind of say the same thing over and over again and I'm very grateful to
01:57:17
this law firm blog that like broke down each piece kind of with less of the legalese yeah so that I
01:57:25
could get kind of like what you're treena hunt dot com victim family yeah website was so that we
01:57:31
can have a clearer indication of like what the what do we know and what is going on and what's
01:57:35
public and what is it yeah so it's a it's a weird situation but here we are yeah despite not having
01:57:41
as much information either of these cases as we would like they're out there and as far as
01:57:46
treena's case goes is still technically unsolved and yeah if you have any information about maybe some
01:57:53
helpful evidence about either one of these cases come forward come come step forward thank you so
01:58:00
much for listening to our episode today thank you again to Molly Walker for your fan pick god bless
01:58:06
I'm ready to detox I'm ready to detox too so let's do that and we'll see you next week bye bye thanks for
01:58:13
listening to wine and crime our cover art is by Danielle Sylvan music by Phil Young and Cory Wendell
01:58:21
editing by Jonathan camp our production manager is Andrea Gardner for photos sources and other
01:58:28
resources head to wine and crime podcast dot com you can follow us on all the socials at wine and
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check out our premium channel at wine and crime podcast dot com slash on court cheers
01:58:56
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02:00:13
all over the world.
02:00:14
Recent episodes include one where a lady survived
02:00:17
a murder attempt by her own son.
02:00:19
But then the week before that,
02:00:20
we just talked about Star Trek.
02:00:21
It can be anything.
02:00:22
It's unpredictable, it's raw, it's real.
02:00:25
Get beautiful anonymous wherever you listen to podcasts.