In this episode, Matt Wagner continues to share his experiences of integrating ministry and business. Building on his previous story, he elaborates on his journey as a business and church leader.

Matt refers to the five-fold ministry model, which links the church’s structure to the human body, and how the five gifts from Ephesians 4—apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, and evangelists—are essential for a healthy church. This framework also applies to business, where Matt and Bill see a similar need for the various gifts to function within companies.

Matt shares how these principles can lead to a more significant impact when business leaders and pastors collaborate, moving away from competition and towards mutual support for God's kingdom. Both Bill and Matt advocate for a servant-leader mindset, where both pastors and business leaders work together in humility, focusing on shared goals and mutual respect, instead of ego. Matt and Gea refer to the global ministry SEAPC as an example where they have seen this modeled. The conversation ends with an optimistic view on the growing shift towards integrating faith into daily work life, with increasing momentum worldwide.

Training Kingdom Mindsets for Business

You are invited to join the May 2025 cohort and follow the ten-weeks online training 'Kingdom Mindsets for Business' hosted by Bill and Gea. Two different cohorts will start on May 14th, 2025. For more info about the difference between the two cohorts and the content of the training, see BAM Moves >