Hello everyone this is Krista with Episode #176 on the Wag Out Loud pawdcast. As much as we sometimes want to hug a dog, animal psychologists say that dogs can be stressed and unhappy when they're hugged. And it's because they see having a limb thrown over them as a sign of dominance. They'll show that stress by licking their lips, looking away, or folding their ears. So maybe go for a belly rub or a butt scratch over a hug whenever you want to show your dog some love.

Welcome to the Wag Out Loud pawdcast, where we are obsessed with bringing you helpful tips on canine health care, nutrition, and overall wellbeing. If you'd like to support the show, check out the amazing online events, products and resources that I personally recommend on the Wag Out Loud website. I'm your host, Krista and I'm super excited to be bringing you yet another tail wagging episode.

Karen Pedersen is a content writer and passionate dog owner from Minneapolis, Minnesota, where she lives with her husband Scott, dogs Tico and Taco, and Cocoa the cat. She has been involved in dog rescue since 2005 and has a soft spot for fostering dogs who need surgery or have other medical issues. She is currently learning more than she ever wanted to about dog reactivity in order to help one of her rescue dogs, Tico, and has made slow but sure progress and is so proud of him! In her spare time, she travels to visit her four grown children and drags her husband out to the Rocky Mountains to hike and try out the local breweries.

Hello, dog lovers! I am so glad that you're here to learn about how to balance natural versus conventional options for your dog. And to cover this topic today, I have Karen Pedersen. Karen, thank you so much for being on the show.

Thank you very much for having me. I'm just excited to be a part of it.

Let's start this conversation. Well, why don't you introduce yourself and tell us why you wanted to cover this topic of natural versus conventional options?

Sure. Well, as you said, my name is Karen and I am a dog lover since I can remember. I’ve got two dogs right now, I have fostered many, many, many dogs over the years. And it just took me on this journey of learning about different options for treating medical issues or behavioral issues. And I eventually started a blog about it because it was hard to find information. And, you know, I wanted more community where we can share different things that work that aren't just the straight out of the textbook answer for something you might be dealing with with your dog.

Right? Well, when you say so much information, I think that is the problem with the internet these days is that you have so many differing opinions. How is the dog parent supposed to know what is best for my dog? Because it is just overwhelming.

It really is. It's overwhelming. And depending on where you are in your dog owning journey, you know, are you at the beginning where you think everything you read must be true and you need to do it? Or have you reached that stage in life where you're like, oh, there's different ways I can do this. They're all okay. And I need to find a way that works for me and works for my dog.

Exactly. Well, and that's exactly what we talk about here is we have to be our dogs’ advocates when it comes to their health and wellness. Absolutely. Well, why don't we start? How would you define natural pet ownership?

You know, I think natural pet ownership, it can mean so many things. It might be your approach to medical issues. You might be someone who tries a food change or supplement or acupuncture, instead of just going straight for a prescription medication for a medical issue. It could be your approach to training and behavior. Maybe you use things like decompression walks, or mentally stimulating toys or calling supplements. If your dog is reactive, and you're trying to work with that behavior, it could be your food choices. Some people want to feed their dogs home cooked meals or raw diets. Others want to buy kibble at the store. So it's just this combination of so many things, and it's really different and unique for every dog owner.

Right? I think a lot of people when I speak with them, you know, how did you get turned on to holistic or integrative approaches to Canine care. A lot of times their dogs have an issue that conventional medicine couldn't fix or treat. And the pet parent just gets so frustrated and says okay, I'm at the end of my rope. I want to try natural. Let's go! Do you agree with that?

I think you're right. I think many times you start your journey because your your animal has an issue. For me, you know I'm I was in my 20s I had my first dog and when she turned nine suddenly she started having cluster seizures. So I'm kind of an information maniac so I started reading everything I could find about what can cause seizures. And I stumbled on this article by Dr. Jean Dodds, out in California about the connection between thyroid levels and seizures in dogs. And so I talked to my vet who was conventional. And he said, Well, we can just run a thyroid test here. And I had my first experience in advocating for my pet. And I said, What I'd really like to do is have you do the blood draw, and I'd like to send it to Dr. Dodds’ BloodBank Hemopet out in California. And it was eye opening, because she turned out to be on the low end of normal. So at my vet, they would have said, Nope, she's normal. That's not the issue. But at Hemopet, they do a more intensive thyroid panel, and they take in to account the breed and age. And so Dr. Dodds said, No, this low end of normal for her age, and her breed could actually be the cause. So she started her on seizure medications, which my vet was totally on board with switch, we switched to a raw diet, and her seizures decreased dramatically, we got two more quality years of life with her. So for me, it was very eye opening, because then I realized, you know, every vet’s gonna have a different opinion. And you kind of have to find your own path for your pet and your person. And you have to educate yourself, and then choose the approach that works for you. Don't just believe everything you read or everything you hear.

Yep, I totally agree. Well, it's funny. Well, it's not funny, this is not a good situation when your dog has seizures. But I can totally relate because I was one of the pet parents that just didn't know any different. I was feeding kibble, my dog out of the blue started having seizures, three different vets could not figure out the cause. And at the same time, we were getting a second dog and she was already an adult. And the breeder said, we are not going to sell her to you unless you promise to feed raw, like, Oh, she's gonna eat raw. And Higgins might as well eat raw as well. And wouldn’t you know it, within I know, it was like, three, five days, no more seizures ever. It was one change to a raw, natural species appropriate diet that did the trick. And that was the start of my journey. So you and I have a lot in common. Karen, do you believe that conventional veterinary medicine does have its place?

Oh, absolutely. I mean, I've been very lucky, I live in a city where I have access to holistic vets. But I have my conventional vet that I've seen for a long time. And he is very open. So you know it always every vet is specific, you can have a holistic vet that you don't click with. But he will help me weigh options sometimes. And I might go see a holistic specialist. And then my vet and I will discuss, you know, should we do this? Or should we do that? I remember one instance where I had a foster dog with a horrible staph infection on his skin and the conventional vet diagnosed it and he said, You know, I want to put him on maybe 18 days of steroids. And I was like, oh, you know, they're so bad for the dog. He's going to be drinking and peeing everywhere. You know, do we have any other options here? And he said, You know, when you have a staph infection this severe, I just don't see a way you're going to get rid of it. Without steroids. He said, Now, maybe we could just do 12 days or, you know, a lower number of days. And if we see a turnaround, we could try stopping there. And I'm like, Okay, that seems reasonable. Because this was a dog who was a senior, he had years of horrible care. So I knew that this was a deeply embedded problem, that we might need conventional, to get us to a point where we could start to use more natural and holistic methods to heal his immune system and start to, you know, start to really work at the root issues. So I do think you have to find a balance. And none of us want our dogs to be miserable. And none of us have unlimited financial resources. There's just so many things that play into it.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. Well, my story recently, our dog Winston got sick. Back in November right around Thanksgiving, didn't know what it was. He was already almost 14. They said it could be auto immune, it could be cancer. And we just didn't want to do the invasive diagnostic testing. And I am so much about holistic, let's do holistic, but I was faced with he is really sick, his red blood cell count his platelets just crashed. We had to have the help of an internal medicine conventional doctor, keep him alive for a couple more months. And to this day he passed late January, and we still don't know what it was. But we got two more months with him because of prednisone, which is an unbelievable drug in the right instance. So I'm with you there. And you know, what if my dog breaks their leg or needs surgery, yes, conventional medicine all day long. But if there is a way to seek a natural approach, I and many more of us are figuring out wow, there are ways to treat ticks and fleas without harsh chemicals. Or do I really have to give that heartworm medication for the what if my dog even gets heartworm and the vaccines? And it's it's a balance, and I'm totally on board with you. And, you know, I