Iraola: The next supercoach?
Update: 2025-01-22
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Andoni Iraola’s Bournemouth produced one of the performances of the season as they demolished Newcastle at the weekend.
They are now seventh in the Premier League and eyeing up European football for next season.
So how much of their success is down to Iraola - and will they be able to keep hold of him for much longer?
Host: Ayo Akinwolere
With: Jon Mackenzie, Phil Hay, Dermot Corrigan
Executive Producer: Adey Moorhead
Producer: Mike Stavrou
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00:00:00
So it's a new year and you're thinking how am I going to make this year different?
00:00:03
How am I going to build something for myself?
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I'm dying to be my own boss or see if I can turn this business idea that I've been kicking around into a reality.
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But I don't know how to make it happen.
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No coding or design skills required, all you need to do is drag and drop.
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Shopify makes it easy to manage your growing business.
00:00:35
They help with the details like shipping, taxes and payments from one single dashboard, allowing you to focus on the important stuff, like growing your business.
00:00:43
What happens if you don't act now?
00:00:44
Will you regret it?
00:00:45
What if someone beats you to the idea?
00:00:47
Don't kick yourself when you hear this again in a year because you didn't do anything now.
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Established in 2025 has a nice ring to it, doesn't it?
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Go to Shopify.com/theathletic to start selling with Shopify today.
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00:02:13
The athletic FC podcast network.
00:02:21
Welcome to the athletic FC podcast with me, I.O.
00:02:23
Akin Molero.
00:02:24
And Donny Iriole's Bournemouth produced one of the performances of the season as they demolished Newcastle at the weekend.
00:02:36
They announced seventh in the Premier League and iron up European football for next season.
00:02:41
So how much of their success is down to Iriole?
00:02:44
And will they be able to keep hold of him much longer?
00:02:50
With us today, we have an Iriole Superfan, John McKenzie, Spanish football writer, Dermak Corrigan, plus lead writer for the athletic FC newsletter, Phil Hay, as well.
00:02:59
Jets good to have you with us, Dermak.
00:03:01
Let's rewind slightly.
00:03:02
Take us back to Iriole in Spain before his time in Bournemouth.
00:03:06
Can you give us a little bit of a background as to his ascent into one of the most exciting Spanish coaches out there?
00:03:12
Yeah.
00:03:13
Iriole was right back for the athletic bill, a really long-serving paid over 500 games for the athletic bill, much loved, was a back up for Spain, never got seven caps for Spain, but never really broke into the team.
00:03:24
So he played a few friendies around Euro 2008, World Cup 2010, but didn't get to go to any of those tournaments.
00:03:30
Just wasn't quite at that level, but he was hugely important player for the athletic bill, a really reliable guy at right back.
00:03:36
Wasn't a attack minded right back under different coaches.
00:03:39
Ernesto Valverde is a big influence on him as a coach, he's now back at the athletic bill, that was the coach, and he was also there under Marcelo Bielsa during that very exciting season for Marcelo Bielsa when athletic bill,
00:03:51
that beat Manchester United in the Europa League era, was one of the key players in that team, a leader, a kind of understated leader in the team.
00:03:59
Not a big flashy guy, but one of the key members of the team, then he went off and kind of educated himself, went to play for New York City, learned English, got to see life outside of Spain,
00:04:11
outside of Spanish football, outside of basketball, as a coach went to Cyprus with Larnica, came to Mirandes in Spain's second vision, then took over at Raya Vallecano, which is where he really made his name as a coach of the tremendous job of Raya Vallecano,
00:04:24
which is a basket case of a club really, it's here in Madrid, but there are always financial troubles, institutional troubles, squabbles, there's always got on at Valleca's,
00:04:35
but he got them promoted, and pretty much with the same team as he got them promoted, he established them as one of the best better teams in La Liga, famous victories over Barcelona, over Real Madrid,
00:04:45
with basically the same side that he got promoted, and from there people were like, this guy is one of the, he's going to be a star as a manager, different Spanish clubs had a look at him, but he ended up going to the Premier League,
00:04:56
where it worked out pretty well for Bournemouth.
00:04:58
I remember at the time, there's a lot of people maybe around Bournemouth going like, why are they going for this guy, who hadn't known about him, but even at that stage in Spain people are like, he's one of the top open coming managers, and it was a coup for Bournemouth again.
00:05:09
Yeah, Phil, Bournemouth get this coach, and you know top coach in Spain, a lot of Spanish teams would love him, but then again, I mean, do you turn out the lure of coaching in the Premier League?
00:05:18
Well, I think that was the question when Bournemouth made him his offer, and he'd had other offers previously.
00:05:23
I was covering Leeds at the time when Leeds were desperate to get him on the back of Sacken Jesse Marsh, and for various reasons, the biggest one being the fact that he was mid-season with Raya via Cannell,
00:05:34
and didn't particularly want to walk out on them by activating his Rico Clause, they didn't get him, and they were relegated.
00:05:42
I suppose from now on, Bournemouth didn't look like the sexiest option, but there is a bit of a new wave in the Premier League at the moment, and I kind of include notting him foresting that, irrespective of their past history.
00:05:53
If you look at the top 12, you've got Palace, you've got Brentford, you've got Fulham, Brighton, Bournemouth, Forest as well, and even Villain, Newcastle, have had to reestablish themselves.
00:06:02
So, I think that tells you, and it tells the coach in fraternity, that clubs can be meaning for players in the Premier League without having the biggest budgets or the most prestige, and there is no league anywhere that gives you more exposure,
00:06:15
I'm sure, a real level of realise that, plus it pays incredibly well.
00:06:19
But he seemed to take his time to decide what to do after Raya, and I think he was pretty savvy in realising that he'd the club at a ceiling, and they'd basically hit it in his last season there.
00:06:29
And I'm not sure another year with them would have done him any good particular reputation, necessarily any good.
00:06:35
And the great thing about Ballmouth was they were a totally blank canvas, you know, there was the risk of relegation, but I think it probably tells you that Raya isn't a risk of airs guy, and they've absolutely followed his lead in trying to create a squad that actually ticks his boxes to use another example,
00:06:48
something that Manchester United seemed to be absolutely terrible at.
00:06:51
And, you know, I just think him thriving there will properly pique the interest of other emerging coaches in Europe.
00:06:57
John, you know, I'm going to talk to Dermott about this sort of bask connection, because obviously we look at Tetta, Emery, Zabby, Alonzo as well, being quite prominent coaches in their respective leagues.
00:07:07
But, you know, is there an idea that there is this sort of tactical bask style that you're seeing emerging with those coaches, but also I guess, you know, I always also a disciple of BLC,
00:07:18
if you think about his time at Bill Ball.
00:07:20
Yeah, I think that's the interesting thing, because I think most coaches from a tactical point of view, you can trace their genealogy, not geographically, but by the coaches that they've worked on there.
00:07:30
I think the coaches that you've named have all got very, very different tactical styles.
00:07:34
In fact, you could spread them probably across the spectrum from the sort of more high-possession control in coaches on the one side with coaches like Alonzo and our Tettas,
00:07:44
as you've named, Emery somewhere in the middle maybe, and then I think Ereola on the other side of the spectrum entirely.
00:07:52
And as you mentioned, that is probably one of genealogy, the coaches that they've worked on there.
00:07:56
So with our Tettas, like the interesting confluence of both Pet Guardiola on the one side who he sort of comes through in the coaching side of things, but also David Moise when he was there at Everton as well.
00:08:07
And I think that's influenced the way that he plays.
00:08:09
So yeah, I think with Ereola, definitely you can trace that BLC influence intensity out of possession, finding upside in the outer possession side of the game,
00:08:20
but also having these really nicely constructed, I would say counter-attacking moves where the ball goes from end-to-end really quickly, you can see the influence of BLC there.
00:08:30
John, do you remember the muddle ball at least?
00:08:32
I do remember the muddle ball that was spoken right so often.
00:08:34
So for those who don't know, and it's a very sort of famous training drill that BLC has, but it's a kind of wild 11-on-a-living game where the ball is in play constantly.
00:08:44
There are no fouls given everybody piles in and runs themselves to a standstill, and I wrote about it about three or four years ago, and I got in touch with Ereola because he'd experienced an athletic bill bow and he was joking that it was the night before was always when he had an extra ball of rice because it was going to be so difficult.
00:09:01
But what I was really, because at the time he was coaching in the Spanish lower league, so what I was interested to know was, do you try to replicate it, you know, if you try to copy that?
00:09:09
And his answer was basically no chance.
00:09:12
I think there are two reasons for that.
00:09:13
One is that I don't think you can put players through a routine like muddle ball and keep them on side long-term unless you've got a bit of a BLC-like order.
00:09:22
But I think he was also saying, you know, there might be bits of BLC in me, but I have got my own mind.
00:09:27
I do do my own thing, I've got my own ideas, and he just strikes me as a guy with a very, very intelligent streak.
00:09:33
Yeah, and is there a connection there?
00:09:36
We talk about intelligence.
00:09:37
I know he's tried to be a lawyer before we became a professional football adermot, but you know, these bass coaches seeking pastures are new.
00:09:44
You know, we talk about him going to America, obviously coached in Cyprus, but Ere talks are spoken about traveling and trying to enrich that knowledge base.
00:09:52
Is that something we see as a similarity between him, Zaby, Alonza, Arterta, Emory, and of course, now we're talking Erella as well.
00:09:59
Yeah, I went to San Sebastian, wasn't the only football rider to go to San Sebastian to try and find out what is the magic in the water up there.
00:10:07
Ereola played for Antiguoco with Arterta and Alonza, the same bass, you team.
00:10:12
And everybody up there is basically like, no, it's not.
00:10:15
As John is saying, it's not a side of football, they all play different styles and they all have their own strengths and weaknesses and influences from, you know, other managers that they've played under.
00:10:25
What Ereola did is he moved very quickly from San Sebastian, where he grew up to Arterta feel about, the rival club along the coast.
00:10:32
And one of the things that I've been about is they do have a very set identity.
00:10:36
They only use players who are born in the bass country.
00:10:38
And that means that the coach has to adapt himself to the players that he has.
00:10:43
It's not that they can go and sign whoever they want.
00:10:45
And it also means that the individual is not as important as the collective hook there.
00:10:49
They have a very strong plan where they all have to work for each other.
00:10:52
They all have to back each other up.
00:10:54
And the coach becomes very important in that situation that he's able to come up with a plan that suits the players that he has.
00:11:01
Ernesto Valverde, who's the current athletic bio coach who was at Barcelona as well, was a huge influence on Ereola in that.
00:11:08
The very similar characters as well, they're understated, they very clever, don't particularly like dealing with the media, maybe, but do what they have to do.
00:11:17
And you can see that in the different clubs that Ereola was at, especially in Spain, where it wasn't that he was going out at Royal and saying, "I need a new centre forward because there's no way we can play."
00:11:26
He wasn't saying, "This is my system.
00:11:27
We have to play this way."
00:11:28
He looked at what he had.
00:11:30
Did a huge amount of work on the training ground to install automations into the team.
00:11:34
So everybody knew where they had to be at a certain time.
00:11:36
If the ball goes here, you have to be here.
00:11:38
When I make this pass, you make that run.
00:11:40
And it just became second nature to players who played hugely above anything that they had played previously in their careers, and pulled off those amazing results, like beaten right at home.
00:11:49
Like beaten bars.
00:11:50
Like beaten bars.
00:11:51
One of three out of four games and drawing the other one with only conceding one goal, something like that.
00:11:55
Incredible results for Ereola, but it became, it almost became not that much of a surprise.
00:12:02
Yeah.
00:12:03
John, I just think, you know, I mean, it's all going well right now, the narrative of my change in the next season or towards the end of the season for sure, but, you know, I do wonder if, if that sort of foundation of what he did at Vicarno in terms of not being able to work with much actually works really well with what he's doing at Bournemouth right now.
00:12:21
You know, they've got a whole heap of injuries as well.
00:12:22
Let's not forget.
00:12:23
But also he's managing to transmit those ideas to a group of players and getting the best out of them right now.
00:12:30
Yeah.
00:12:31
Good coach is coach good, I think, and that's always what you have to take into account when you're assessing how good a manager is because often I think the context of into which players are fitted can sometimes suit them and you can see players improve because of the context that they're in.
00:12:45
But I think what you can also see with Ereola is that there's definitely an individual focus to his training.
00:12:51
There's so many players who've come through even in a short time at Bournemouth so far who've who've who've improved because of the coaching that he's done.
00:12:59
So I'm thinking Dom Salanky is this a classic example of this before, you know, before last season.
00:13:05
I don't think anyone really would have considered Salanky as a as a starting forward for for spurs and I think this season, even with spurs problems, it's clear that that Salanky has taken to that task really well.
00:13:16
But there's plenty of other players in that team as well who I think just flourished under him, even taking someone like Ryan Christie, dropping him a little bit deeper using him as the sort of beating heart of his his control room in that team.
00:13:27
But even like peripheral players like David Brooks, for example, who's been brought in this season because of injury issues, a player that I didn't really expect to see a huge amount from in the context,
00:13:37
but actually even just seeing him play regularly, you can see the the influence that he's had that Ereola's had on on these various players.
00:13:45
So I think that, you know, the fact that there's players like Milosh Kirk has being touted as potential signings for clubs like Liverpool.
00:13:52
All of this comes back to Ereola, he's he's not only improved the team from a collective structural point of view, but I think also individually you can see the signs of his handiwork as well.
00:14:01
Okay.
00:14:02
Thanks for that.
00:14:03
I want to go more into that in the second part of this podcast, but I know Dermot you've got to go.
00:14:07
So thank you so much for your time brother.
00:14:08
Cheers.
00:14:09
Nice.
00:14:10
You're listening to the Athletic FC podcast with I.O.
00:14:14
Ackemwelleri.
00:14:16
So it's a new year and you're thinking how am I going to make this year different?
00:14:19
How am I going to build something for myself?
00:14:21
I'm dying to be my own boss or see if I can turn this business idea that I've been kicking around into a reality, but I don't know how to make it happen.
00:14:29
Shopify is how you're going to make it happen and let me tell you how.
00:14:33
The best time to start your new business right now Shopify makes it simple to create your brand open for business and get your first sale.
00:14:40
Get your store up and running easily with thousands of customizable templates.
00:14:44
No coding or design skills required.
00:14:46
All you need to do is drag and drop Shopify makes it easy to manage your growing business.
00:14:51
They help with the details like shipping taxes and payments from one single dashboard allowing you to focus on the important stuff like growing your business.
00:14:59
What happens if you don't act now?
00:15:00
Will you regret it?
00:15:01
What if someone beats you to the idea?
00:15:03
Don't kick yourself when you hear this again in a year because you didn't do anything now.
00:15:08
Established in 2025 has a nice ring to it, doesn't it?
00:15:11
Sign up for your $1 per month trial period at Shopify.com/theathletic all lower case.
00:15:17
Go to Shopify.com/theathletic to start selling with Shopify today.
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00:16:30
Sometimes you have to attack direct, make them defend one against one.
00:16:33
I think we have good threats outside with Bruxy, with Antoine, Justin, Dango, and we wanted to make them feel this threat.
00:16:41
There's a vote for the Nilsand, the vitality stadium in Rucks, A&C Bournemouth, spooned it up against the Champions.
00:16:52
It's a menu.
00:16:53
It's rifleed into the net.
00:16:57
It's not many teams put the same James' talk and completely dominate in the final third.
00:17:23
Yeah, some of Bournemouth highlights this season.
00:17:31
I think we should actually delve more into what Eriola is doing at Bournemouth in particular.
00:17:36
Now, you know, that went over Newcastle extended their club record and beat and run in the top flight to 10.
00:17:41
I guess one of the most impressive things about Eriola is how he's bounced back from, I guess, the awful start he had at Bournemouth.
00:17:48
Just three points from their first nine league matches, Phil, it's pretty impressive how we turned that around.
00:17:54
But also, I think, just the faith the Bournemouth had that, you know what?
00:17:57
Let's stick with this guy and let's see what he can actually do.
00:18:00
That feels like it never happened that period.
00:18:02
It feels so long ago now that you can't remember the point where everybody was saying bad decision this.
00:18:08
Not only could you just to Bournemouth for sticking with him through that, but you remember when Gary O'Neill was replaced by Eriola, there was something that it felt typically British to me actually.
00:18:18
This thing of Gary O'Neill is a good man who's done a good job and this isn't what we do around here.
00:18:23
You know, he deserves a bit more courtesy and a bit more respect.
00:18:26
But Bournemouth stuck to the guns in a big way with that and they went for Eriola and it's worked incredibly well and I think part of the reason it has worked well is because of that dreadful word synergy which they do actually have.
00:18:39
A lot of clubs talk about it but a lot don't really have it, whereas Bournemouth seemed to have totally aligned Eriola and his attitude towards tactics in the way they're going to play and what they're doing in the recruitment market.
00:18:52
It seemed incredibly good at ticking the boxes that he wants them to tick time and time again.
00:18:57
John's done great analysis of Bournemouth right from the start with Eriola and the further you go down the burrow the more you kind of see it as science rather than, you know, there's no bluff involved in this.
00:19:07
It's as if Eriola knows exactly what it is that he wants to do.
00:19:11
He knows exactly how it should work, isn't going to work all the time.
00:19:14
You know, it's not like the high press is 100% perfect but I was joking in the newsletters saying, you know, when it does work, it's like an alcatraz that Sean Connery couldn't get out of.
00:19:24
I love the speed of the attacking play, I love the width and I didn't have like the comment on Twitter X over the weekend which was, can I asking, you know, is Justin Clive at the first son of an iconic footballer who's actually been any good?
00:19:36
Yeah, good point actually, really good point.
00:19:38
I want to go to Justin Clive at just a second but yeah, tactically John, as Phil's just said, I mean, this is a well drilled side, a very well coaxed side.
00:19:46
Yeah, I think the phrase that I love to use is talking about Eriola is this concept of outlier advantage and what I mean by that is that I think the majority of teams in the Premier League are trying to do something similar to one another,
00:19:58
which is control games.
00:20:00
They want to control game with the ball, they want to build up, they want to have sustainable possession, they want to be able to create goals in a sustainable way, but they also want to control games when they don't have the ball as well.
00:20:08
So they have now these intricate pressing approaches which can, you know, force teams to go into certain areas to make it easier for them, et cetera, to stop them from scoring.
00:20:17
And I think what Eriola is doing is he's taking that concept that teams want to control games and he's sort of flipping it on its head and he's saying, well, fine, we're going to stop you from being able to control games.
00:20:26
And they do that in a number of different ways, both in and out of possession.
00:20:29
I think the out of possession side of things is the one that people have really latched on to because, you know, it is a really intense press.
00:20:35
It is a really suffocating press and it is a really productive press as well.
00:20:39
So it's easy to see why they might do that.
00:20:41
So generally what they're doing is they're trying to increase the tempo, reduce the amount of time that teams have on the ball and as a result, make it harder for them to control games in that way.
00:20:50
But I think also you see that in their in possession play as well because not only are they looking to when they win the ball back to attack directly and make the most of teams being destabilized because they've lost the ball in a in a situation that isn't advantageous to them.
00:21:04
But also when they're building from the back, you can often see them just going super direct, going directly into their front line, looking to win second balls, looking to stop the opponent from being able to get into a comfortable in possession shape,
00:21:16
which they can build from.
00:21:17
So this is all about this outlier advantage.
00:21:19
It's about changing the game state that most teams are used to being in and being better prepared to deal with the chaos when when it unfolds.
00:21:27
And I think as we've seen that that's really come out quite nicely in the Premier League where that, you know, all teams are generally looking for that control, born with a founder way to destabilize that and it's working out well for them.
00:21:38
Yeah.
00:21:39
I mean, I just want to have that conversation now then to remove it forward is Clive at the best one of one of the greats ever to play in the Premier League.
00:21:48
There's actually any good because actually the irony of just in Clive at scoring against Newcastle is that actually play for Newcastle as well.
00:21:54
But he's come good second hat trick of the season, but he's actually looking like a talisman in this team.
00:22:00
Yeah.
00:22:01
Incredible.
00:22:02
So that's a good one for Patrick against Newcastle.
00:22:06
He scored more goals at St.
00:22:08
James's Park than his dad or something like that.
00:22:10
So one of those one of those fun facts that he won for Christmas.
00:22:13
Yeah, exactly.
00:22:14
But yeah, he's a great example of a player who came in and I thought, you know, to talk about Synergy as Phil was saying, you know, this is a club which has plans that they're trying to find advantages in the market.
00:22:26
And one of those advantages, I think, is bringing in players who maybe have been hyped around Europe and maybe haven't done quite so well.
00:22:32
So I was sort of on the fence about whether or not it would work out, but absolutely been a success story at Bournemouth.
00:22:38
I think that the play style suits him really well and, you know, the level of coaching that they have done before talking about the players, you know, knowing how they need to respond when they turn the ball over so that they can repeatedly and sustainably generate really nice chances out of that.
00:22:53
He's a real beneficiary of that approach.
00:22:55
And yeah, it looks like, looks like scoring almost every week at the moment.
00:22:59
And yeah, it's been a real joy watching him play.
00:23:01
But I think there's plenty of other players out there who've really benefited from this as well.
00:23:05
We talked, I think that the really important players, I mean, people are going to talk about Semenio and Tuan Semenio, who has one of those really nice fairytale stories of having played at lots of different levels across the English pyramid.
00:23:16
But to an extent, I think, you know, the trajectory that he's had, I just sort of expected him to do it okay.
00:23:22
I think there's other players who are more interesting from that point of view.
00:23:26
As Ryan Christie, I mentioned before, Lewis Cook in midfield, again, like a player with a lot of pedigree, but now in this system has, he has a real sort of, I think, a real sort of edge and identity in this system.
00:23:38
Those two are super important because so much of the press that Eureola uses is about those central midfielders interpreting the way that the player is going and having to cover a number of different options and be able to make the decision in the moment,
00:23:50
which is the most dangerous marking responsibility for them and taking those up without players like that.
00:23:56
I think now with Tyler Adams coming in, that midfield makes the press functional or not.
00:24:00
The reason why it took them 10 games to get going is because they didn't have that level of functionality in the press and so teams were just breaking through them.
00:24:07
Now they have that because of the intelligence of those players in the middle, the creativity of those players to be able to press well, win the ball back and then recycle it in dangerous ways.
00:24:16
I think really, really important too.
00:24:17
There's just a couple of words for some of the defenders as well because Bournemouth's numbers in terms of the defensive side of things really impressive, given their pressing is so aggressive.
00:24:26
Like, often when teams press so aggressively, I mean, we had Eric Tenhaag and Manchester United last season with these teams just completely wide open when their press didn't succeed.
00:24:35
Bournemouth are really good at not only jumping into those high pressing, man-to-man moments, but dropping deep into more zone or structured blocks which are harder to break down.
00:24:43
I think a big part of that is to do with the centre backs, Marco Snezzi is injured at the moment, but him and Zabani last season, I mean Ilya Zabani not often talked about in Premier League conversations, he played every minute last season,
00:24:54
he's played every minute this season, I'm pretty sure I'm correct in saying that, if not, it's, you know, a few minutes either way, ever present and just a stalwart in that defence.
00:25:03
Dean Huyson coming through now, centre back that was brought in from Serya, has been thrown in at the deep end because Snezzi is injured and he's just been fantastic as well.
00:25:12
These players are absolutely fundamental to the play style as well.
00:25:15
And yeah, I think often Huyson is obviously being talked about, but I think Zabani often goes under the radar a little bit and even Kirk has obviously another one of those hyped players,
00:25:26
but on the other side, Adam Smith, you know, a journeyman career right at the end of his time in football as a player, but he's been absolutely fundamental as well and you know, they've brought in a few different options to play that right back position and it's always ended up coming back to Adam Smith as well.
00:25:42
So yeah, some really important performances from players and again, I think that speaks to how well this team has been coached by Ereola.
00:25:50
Don't know about you, Phil, but I think John does like the old Bournemouth, doesn't he?
00:25:53
I've never seen him die in my life.
00:25:55
Look at him.
00:25:56
He's really streaming and they haven't got to go knowledge, brilliant.
00:26:00
But look, I mean, I think something we spoke about this week already, it has been spurs and how they've cut through their injury issues, Phil.
00:26:07
But you know, we look at Bournemouth here, you look at injuries to the likes of Snezzi, Tavanere, Sinistera, Eva Nielsen, who they've got from Porto and Azuna as well.
00:26:16
I mean, they've had their injury issues as well, but he's managed even with this intensity of play to cope with those injuries.
00:26:23
Absolutely.
00:26:24
You know, they're in line with one of the problems for Posta Cogli.
00:26:27
The time in the weekend was almost as bad as it could have possibly been for him because he goes to Everton, you know, seriously down on numbers and spurs get rinsed really badly at Goodison Park.
00:26:37
Forget about the score line.
00:26:38
It was a real mess for most of that game.
00:26:42
Bournemouth go to Newcastle and don't forget that Newcastle were the division's form team with the division's form striker and ESAC, with exactly the same excuse, but have absolutely no need to play that card or to try and play that card because they turn up and place well.
00:26:58
And, you know, I would rank Newcastle's midfield amongst one of the best in the Premier League and Bournemouth's performance against it was the thing that stood out for me, in Clive it obviously took the headlines with the hat trick,
00:27:08
but the way in which they were able to control that game and get a foothold and it was so impressive.
00:27:14
And again, it comes down to the fact that they clearly understand the realist tactics and they're clicking incredibly, incredibly well.
00:27:22
I think it's safe to say that if the injuries carry on as badly as they've been for Bournemouth and they're probably going to take effect at some point, it's almost inevitable because fatigue catches up with players.
00:27:31
You don't have the same ability to rotate and there's not a lot you can do, but it seems like a very humble guy does a real and I just can't imagine him trying to play the injury card at all.
00:27:41
It's just not his style.
00:27:42
If I could just jump in.
00:27:43
I think what's really interesting about the difference between Spurs and Bournemouth is that...
00:27:47
That was my question too.
00:27:48
I thought it's really interesting.
00:27:49
We've had a lot of feedback on it on YouTube and Spurs fans are saying, "Why are you comparing us to Bournemouth?"
00:27:53
And I'm interested in your feedback on that actually.
00:27:55
Yeah.
00:27:56
So Spurs, the system that Postercoglu's implemented is reliant on technical skill and superiority, right?
00:28:04
So they've lost the two centrebacks who have fundamental to the build-up and the defensive aspects of that team.
00:28:07
They play really aggressively, positionally, so that those two centrebacks are often the only two in the front, the first line of build-up, which means they're obviously the only two left in the last line of defence.
00:28:17
And that means that you require really, really technically superior players to be able to do that.
00:28:21
When Spurs don't have van de Ven and Romero playing, the system doesn't work.
00:28:25
Whereas I think the beauty of Bournemouth's approach is because it isn't out of possession first approach, as I'd call it, they're thinking predominantly, "What can we do without the ball?"
00:28:34
Because we're going to, as a team, that isn't going to have the ball a lot.
00:28:36
We're going to be more often than not without it, so let's make sure we're good at that side of things.
00:28:39
I think it's much easier to then port players in off the bench to still be able to perform the same level.
00:28:45
The system doesn't fall to pieces.
00:28:47
And I think obviously that still requires a huge amount of coaching expertise to be able to make sure that you're maintaining a whole squad of players who can play the system.
00:28:54
But I think it also gives a really nice buffer to Ereol.
00:28:57
If he loses a player, yeah, look, it's not great when you lose Ennis Unal and Evan Nielsen, you're two strikers.
00:29:03
But the system itself can still cope with that.
00:29:05
And you know, I think Bournemouth would have been better if they'd had a striker profile in that nine-slot, other than Dango Wattara, who's played really well there.
00:29:13
But if they'd had that striker, it would have changed things, but the system is still able to cope with those losses of players all around the pitch in a way that I don't think Spurs system can.
00:29:23
Now, let's talk about the recruitment, feel very quickly, and you know, a big part of that success that we've spoken about, a whole heap of players, are the players that they've brought into the club.
00:29:30
Obviously, they sold Dominix and Lanky to Spurs, as we're talking about Spurs, and we're able to reinvest Evan Nielsen and also on Hoysen as well.
00:29:38
Who is behind it?
00:29:39
Obviously Richard Hughes went to Liverpool who would have been in charge of player recruitment, but who is now in charge or who's driving it forward from now?
00:29:46
Well, they've got the same in Francis.
00:29:48
I mean, John will know a lot more about their recruitment structure than they are but they've got Simon Francis who, I think, must have benefited from learning on the job with Richard Hughes.
00:29:56
I mean, they've only had two seasons, I think I'm right in saying, outside of the Premier League in the past decade or so.
00:30:02
So it'd be wrong to say that they're just finally getting it together now.
00:30:06
What I do think is that, and you know, this seems fairly obvious, that the whole project just has so much more purpose now than it did when they were in the Premier League first time round, and perhaps that's inevitable.
00:30:16
They've also got Thiago Pinto, who gives them, you know, more serious structure, but more of the sort of structure that you'd expect, have an established Premier League club.
00:30:24
And they evidently have a kind of laser vision when it comes to finding what it is that Iriola wants in the market.
00:30:30
On top of that, you mentioned Selanki.
00:30:33
They seem pretty good to me at spreading the money around when it does come in.
00:30:36
I mean, Clive is, you know, what about £10 million?
00:30:40
I mean, I'm not being funny, but that's what they're talking about, Sheffield United paying for Ben Brirott and Diaz, if they go up this season, and, you know, I think I know where I'd rather take for the cash.
00:30:50
So when you sort of ally that with Iriola's now, so you can totally see why it's working and that basically is how Clive's flourish, that it's all joined up, the thing can make sense, and in the end they do the right things when they have to.
00:31:02
I guess the real test for Bournemouth Football Operation staff is this, who is on the list for when Iriola goes, because much more of this, and it's inevitable isn't it, that someone's going to try and buy him out of there,
00:31:14
and he must think you can go right to the top.
00:31:16
Yeah, do you think they are thinking of the future with that Iriola, John?
00:31:20
Obviously, he's made such a mark.
00:31:21
It is the main season where we've really seen what he's been able to do with this team.
00:31:26
But, you know, the Premier League, every team would love a good manager to steer him in the right direction.
00:31:30
Yeah, I mean, we started off the show by saying Bournemouth had Gary O'Neill before they had Iriola.
00:31:36
He kept them up that season, and then they moved him up.
00:31:39
That is the starting of a club with a, with a plan.
00:31:42
So yeah, they will absolutely have a short list, I have a long list and a short list, and no doubt they're all over the concept that the Iriola is going to be hot property.
00:31:49
I mean, it has been hot property, no doubt, but it's going to be hot property going into the next few windows, so they'll definitely have a plan and it will definitely be a good one,
00:32:01
I'm sure.
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00:33:04
Terms and Conditions Apply You know,
00:33:16
at the beginning of the season, I'm an ambitious person.
00:33:19
You know, we get a lot of ambitious players in the team.
00:33:21
The Bournemouth did a great job recruiting like those kind of players that have a lot of ambition.
00:33:26
And I think you see that in how we speak about, yeah, we want to play Europe.
00:33:29
We want to be the best that we can.
00:33:31
And I think we show that also.
00:33:32
So, yeah, why not?
00:33:33
I'm not dream big.
00:33:34
And let's see where we can end up.
00:33:36
When you say Europe, do you mean the Champions League?
00:33:38
You never know, Europe.
00:33:39
Yeah, let's keep it on Europe.
00:33:40
But the Champions League, you know, they've got a great teams in the Premier League.
00:33:44
So that would be very tough, but yeah, who knows, yeah, who knows?
00:33:47
That was the weekend's Hattrick Hero Justin Cliveau who is daring to dream about Europe.
00:33:52
John, this is the big question.
00:33:54
Can they sustain it enough to be playing European football next season?
00:33:59
Yeah, I mean, it's a really crazy season in many respects.
00:34:01
It's very hard to judge what is what, I think, you know, the decline in Manchester City is sort of thrown everyone out.
00:34:06
It's hard to judge what level everyone's at.
00:34:08
And then obviously, on top of that, you've got Spurs and Manchester United looking like they're out of the question.
00:34:13
So, I definitely think a few slots have opened up in that European tranche right at the top of the table.
00:34:17
Yeah, on the balance of things, if you'd asked me a couple of weeks ago, when those injuries came in, I'd say, oh, you know, maybe, maybe not, having seen that they've been able to perform with a largely rotated squad,
00:34:28
it seems much more likely that that could come through.
00:34:31
It'd be great to see them, I think, making it in Europe think of the first time that Bournemouth have played in Europe.
00:34:36
They don't have a stadium made for it, do they?
00:34:38
Yes.
00:34:39
Well, I mean, this is the whole thing, really.
00:34:40
I mean, this is ambition, Phil.
00:34:42
This is potentially, I don't know if it was in the plans of Bournemouth to be in this position.
00:34:47
But, I mean, this is the dream of making it to the Premier League that you've built some sort of an infrastructure that allows you to climb up to the top half of the table and actually potentially bring that dream to a club that potentially has never had it before.
00:35:00
Yeah.
00:35:01
I'm being facetious about the ground.
00:35:02
I've been there loads of times, and actually it's really, like, actually nice, comfortable little ground to go to.
00:35:07
It's sort of damned if they do and damned if they don't because it's always how much more commercial revenue you can get from a bigger stadium.
00:35:13
It does good things for you financially, in that sense.
00:35:15
But what the catchment area actually is around there in terms of fancy we pay for season tickets and pay to come, and how many new fans they could attract, as these go on, despite how well they're doing is probably very much moot and open to debate.
00:35:30
But they are on to a really good thing here, and I personally reckon that Iriola will be really cautious and thoughtful about what he does next.
00:35:39
I mean, as an example, would he have taken the job at Old Trafford at the point where Amarum did it?
00:35:45
I just don't think he would have done it.
00:35:46
I think he would have seen too many pitfalls and too many issues there, not to mention a squad that, I mean, is 100% not made for him at all.
00:35:54
So I would imagine that everybody at Bournemouth is fairly sensible in thinking this is not going to be forever because it can't be forever.
00:36:01
But I reckon he really knows he's on to a good thing there as well.
00:36:03
It's doing him no harm at all.
00:36:05
His reputation is shooting up, and he's built a very, very good, credible Premier League team.
00:36:11
Yeah, John G.C.
00:36:12
Eriola becoming one of the next big coaches.
00:36:15
It's obviously hard to say right now, but are there ingredients enough in there where you're like, actually, that could be a really interesting future for this guy if he goes to a bigger club?
00:36:25
Yeah, this is an interesting topic, I think, because I mentioned before when we were talking about the tactics that what Eriola relies on is this outlier advantage that he gets whereby he tries to destabilise what opposition is doing.
00:36:37
Now, that's a perfectly adequate approach to take to, in a league where you're probably a mid-table squad, and you want to try and find these advantages.
00:36:45
And it works because a lot of the time, as we've said, you're going to be without the ball, you're going to be maybe in losing or drawing game states.
00:36:51
The problem is when you get into these winning game states, when you're ahead in games, suddenly the idea of control becomes much more palatable.
00:36:57
You want to control games.
00:36:58
You want to make sure that you have more of the ball, and the opponents can't do things to you to make you lose your lead.
00:37:04
And actually, this is something that we've seen throughout Eriola's time at Bournemouth in the Premier League.
00:37:09
They've often lost winning positions.
00:37:12
They've dropped out of those winning positions because they've struggled to control those games.
00:37:16
If you throw a manager like that into an elite club, suddenly that changes the dynamics entirely, right?
00:37:21
Because not only are you expected to be in control games, more you're also expected to be in winning game states way more.
00:37:27
And I think because of that, you're going to end up with a loss of that outlier advantage.
00:37:32
Suddenly, you have to become, I guess, sort of mainstream.
00:37:35
This is the big question with Eriola.
00:37:36
What happens when you give him those better players so that his teams can possess the ball better?
00:37:41
Because the more you possess the ball, the more you lose your upside as an out of possession team, generally speaking.
00:37:46
And we've seen the lesson from Arsenal this season has been, they're sort of an elite team who've lent into the out of possession things, and it's a problem eventually for you.
00:37:55
So I think that's the big question with Eriola, how would he make, if he makes that step up to coaching elite sides, how does he negotiate that change from being an outlier to becoming one of the mainstream coaches?
00:38:05
And that's why I think a stepping stone club may be like a move to Spurs so that he can, you know, you're on the way to that elite level.
00:38:13
And get tongues wagging, not now, not now, John.
00:38:16
But I think that's what needs to happen, right?
00:38:18
I think Jürgen Klopp had his Dortmund spell, and that allowed him to make a lot of that evolution from one style to another, that prepared him for Liverpool.
00:38:26
And I think that's the same sort of thing that Eriola needs.
00:38:28
Mackenzie Colespur's stepping stone club, I love it.
00:38:33
Just on the back of what you said there, who in the elite bracket, the absolute top draw bracket in Europe, is then doing what Eriola is doing.
00:38:44
Where is this working at a club that you would consider to be pretty close to the top of the tree?
00:38:49
Do you mean like a team that's doing that sort of out of possession first, high intensity?
00:38:53
Absolutely.
00:38:54
Yeah.
00:38:55
Where would you find similar tactics to Eriola's that are working at a club that would be at a considerably higher level than Bournemouth?
00:39:01
Yeah.
00:39:02
I think that's a really perceptive question, because I don't think there are many teams out there who are even, even just sort of leaning into the chaos.
00:39:08
I think there's a couple of teams in Spain who are doing that, so I think Villarreal doing it a little bit at the moment, and they're doing fairly well in La Liga, all things considered.
00:39:18
But beyond that, like most other teams, I think, are certainly in terms of the out of possession approach.
00:39:25
I think there's been a real shift towards either dropping back into mid-blocks because teams are now so used to to opponents jumping into these high, man-to-man pressing phases that opponents have found ways of going beyond those presses and causing problems there.
00:39:39
You can see that.
00:39:40
You can see that even happening with city to a degree.
00:39:44
But then the other thing that started happening weirdly is that other opponents are going just straight into full man-to-man approaches, so Vinson Company in Bayern, partly because they, you know, when you go man-to-man in out of possession phases,
00:39:55
everything just becomes a one-to-one duel, right, and you feel you watch BLS as leads.
00:40:00
That can work really well when the talent differential isn't massive, but when you're a team like Bayern, those one-to-one duels are all going to end up in your favour because you're going to have better players in every position.
00:40:10
So there's some teams, I think, who are really leaning into the man-to-man approach as well.
00:40:15
So, yeah, in terms of what Eriola is doing, there's not a huge amount, I think, of examples of coaches who are doing that at the top level.
00:40:22
And I think because of what we were talking about, right, making games more chaotic is just not a way of consistently winning enough to win leagues.
00:40:29
It may work well in knockout competitions, but again, like, do you really want to bring in a playstyle, which is, it reminds me of the Jürgen Klopp quote about Dortmund when he was there playing against Bayern,
00:40:41
and what he said is, "What we do so well is we bring them down to our level."
00:40:44
And I think that's what Bournemouth do so well.
00:40:45
They bring other teams at the top of the table down to their level because they change the game state.
00:40:51
The issue becomes when you are the team that needs to maintain that higher level.
00:40:54
It becomes a big problem, so I think that's why we're seeing less of those sorts of teams at the top level.
00:40:59
Let's wrap this up quickly on anyone else out there, other than Eureola, that we are seeing John or where you're looking at, that potentially could be in that sort of bracket for next big coach or next big super coach.
00:41:12
I've already mentioned Vincent Company.
00:41:14
I don't know if he counts as like an up-and-coming coach because when you're at Bayern Munich for half a season and it's going well, I think you've probably made that step up, but I think he's the one who's maybe gone under the radar a little bit because I think what Bayern are doing this season is just utter dominance.
00:41:29
They're dominating in a way that even Pep Guardiola teams haven't done at Man City or Bayern before him.
00:41:37
They're doing in interesting ways both in and out of possession, so I think that if there is going to be a new wave of super coaches that we start talking about, it will be Vincent Company.
00:41:48
I think our tetas probably still within that bracket as well.
00:41:50
I know that's probably not a fashionable thing to say right now, but what you've got with our tetra is, again, a coach has come through and he's changed the meta in many respects.
00:41:59
I think for years to come, no doubt, Vincent Company will eventually end up back in England and I'm sure that they will become the club and Guardiola of the next generation.
00:42:09
So yeah, I don't know if those are two mainstream and you wanted a sort of really...
00:42:13
It's all good.
00:42:14
It's all good.
00:42:15
I'm really fun.
00:42:16
I'll be coming.
00:42:17
It's all good.
00:42:18
It's all good.
00:42:19
Let's edit there, Jets.
00:42:20
I really appreciate your time, Phil, Doma earlier as well and also John for all your insight.
00:42:26
We'll be back tomorrow.
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