In this episode of LevelUp, David and Sean sit down with Amir Haleem, co-founder of Helium and CEO of Nova Labs. Amir shares Helium's decade-long evolution from IoT infrastructure to a decentralized 5G network powering real-world wireless coverage. He breaks down the Helium Mobile business model, how token incentives drive hotspot deployment, and why carrier offload could transform the economics of telecom. The discussion covers network growth, tokenomics, governance, and the future of decentralized physical infrastructure. View the Full Level Up Podcast Disclaimer Here: https://level-up-podcast-disclaimer.super.site/ Key Points From This Episode: [00:00:00 ] David and Sean’s opening segment: Helium overview, HNT stats/market context, DePIN comps, and how Helium’s mobile + offload businesses work [00:12:49 ] Interview begins — Amir joins and frames Helium as a decade-plus journey [00:13:03 ] From video games to Helium: early career in gaming and esports, meeting Sean Fanning, and the origins of the IoT thesis [00:17:13 ] The hardest problem pre-crypto: deploying a wireless network at scale without billions in capital [00:21:24 ] Token evolution: HNT’s role in cold start, Proof-of-Coverage, sub-tokens experiment, and why everything merged back into HNT [00:26:19 ] Product breakdown: hotspot deployment, carrier offload for AT&T/others vs. Helium Mobile’s subscriber (MVNO-like) business [00:34:03 ] Helium Mobile unit economics: offload percentage targets, reducing reliance on T-Mobile, and why traditional MVNOs struggle ​​[00:40:21 ] How the money moves: dollars in → HNT bought and burned → data credits → hotspot payouts at ~$0.50 per GB​ [00:49:30 ] Carrier offload today: live carrier count, Mexico / Telefónica rollout, DAUs, and daily terabytes of traffic [00:53:10 ] Tokenomics today: deflationary dynamics, halving cadence, net issuance turning negative, and fundamentals vs. price [01:01:52 ] Governance and network control: HIP process, vote-locking, why hotspot operators don’t need to stake HNT [01:05:13 ] Clarifying Helium Mobile vs. offload users and how DAU scales across the network [01:22:35 ] Final reflections on Helium’s trajectory and closing thoughts [01:23:59 ] Outro and sign-off Links: The Medici Network: https://www.medici.network/ Podcast Site: https://levelup.medici.network/ Interested in being a Guest? Connect with Elmira on X: https://x.com/elmira_yilham Co-Hosts David Grider, Finality Capital - https://x.com/David_Grid Sean Farrell, Fundstrat Global Advisors - https://x.com/SeanMFarrell Guests Amir Haleem, Helium - https://x.com/amirhaleem Production and editing by The Podcast Consultant - https://thepodcastconsultant.com