Note: This encore episode is dedicated to the memory of Alice Potts, who died on August 20, 2025, aged 81.

“In America aging is often seen as an insult rather than an inevitable human process. We don’t celebrate getting older; we ‘fight’ age by pretending to be young.” –Rolf Potts

In this episode of Deviate Rolf and his parents, Alice and George Potts, talk about how surviving the COVID-19 pandemic has changed their relationship, and how it gave them a pretext to go through a “death checklist” together (3:00 ); how one’s grandparents and parents live on in one’s memories and one’s conversations, the life-values they passed on, and what it felt like when those loved ones declined and died (14:00 ); how, over the years, elderly people and philosophers have come to terms with notions of decline and death (31:00 ); and personal insights about what it’s like to have grown older after having lived a long life (44:00 ).

George and Alice Potts are retired schoolteachers based in Kansas. George taught science at various Wichita high schools, as well as at Friends University, where he pioneered graduate-level programs in Zoo Science and Environmental Studies. He also helped facilitate the Outdoor Wildlife Learning Sites (OWLS) program for the Kansas Department of Wildlife and Parks. Alice taught second graders in the Wichita public schools for more than 30 years. In 1994 her classes succeed in promoting legislation to declare the barred tiger salamander the Kansas State Amphibian.

Notable Links:

• What to Do When a Loved One Dies (AARP death checklist)


• How we die in America (Deviate episode)


• The therapeutic uses of reading scripture (Deviate episode)


• On losing one’s parents to COVID-19 (Deviate episode)


• 1985 World Series (baseball championship)


• Joe Louis (20th century boxing champion)


• John Prine (singer-songwriter)


• Alzheimer’s disease (chronic neurodegenerative disease)


• You Are My Sunshine (folk song)


• Will You Miss Me When I’m Gone (folk song)


• Ecclesiastes (book in the Old Testament of the Bible)


• Epistle of James (book in the New Testament of the Bible)


• Crowfoot (19th century Siksika First Nation chief)


• Ted Kaczynski (the Unabomber)


• Epicurus (ancient Greek philosopher)


• Varanasi (Hindu holy city in India)


• Lamentations 3:22-23 (Old Testament Bible verse)

The Deviate theme music comes from the title track of Cedar Van Tassel’s 2017 album Lumber.

Note: We don’t host a “comments” section, but we’re happy to hear your questions and insights via email, at deviate@rolfpotts.com.