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What happens when the Bible gets treated like a political toolkit instead of a sacred text meant to form our lives? 

In this conversation, Pastor Josh and Will sit down with Brian Kaylor—editor in chief of Word&Way, Baptist minister, and author of The Bible According to Christian Nationalists—to unpack seven common ways scripture gets twisted to serve power. We talk about why Christian nationalism functions as a theological heresy, not just a political ideology, and how to separate healthy patriotism from a fusion of church and state that distorts the gospel.

Brian walks us through how numerology frames like “Ephesians 6:11 at 6:11 ” go viral after violent events and why chapter and verse numbers were never meant to carry hidden messages. We dig into the difference between loving your neighbors and trying to rule them, the history behind public Ten Commandments displays and classroom mandates, and how commodifying the Bible turns faith into a brand. We also get practical about reading in community, broadening the voices that shape our interpretations, and cultivating the humility to say I might be wrong. If you care about faith, civic life, and the integrity of scripture, this episode offers language and tools to navigate a polarized moment without surrendering your soul.

Book: https://bookshop.org/a/112456/9780827203501

Guest Bio
Brian Kaylor is the editor in chief of Word&Way, a Baptist minister, and a scholar of political communication whose work sits at the intersection of faith, civic life, and media. He is the author of The Bible According to Christian Nationalists, a field guide to recognizing and resisting seven common misuses of scripture in public life, and the coauthor of Baptizing America, which traces how mainline Protestants helped cultivate the soil for Christian nationalism to grow. 

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