This episode of Does it Fly? is presented by RSVLTS. Dying to be the star of Spooky Season? Grab this ghoulish gear, if you dare...

A physicist, a pop culture expert, and a paranormal investigator walk into a brewery…no, it’s not the start of a joke, this actually happened! It’s a very different kind of Does it Fly? episode this week. This is our first ever recording with Hakeem and Tamara in the same room, our first in front of a live studio audience, and also the first full blown guest star joining in the discussion. We’re joined by special guest Aaron Sagers (Paranormal Caught on Camera, Talking Strange) to talk about the plausibility of demonic possession. Oh great, you’ve been waiting for our episode on The Exorcist, right? Perhaps because it keeps getting funnier, every single time you see it?

Well guess again boys and ghouls. We’re kicking off this Halloween season a little early not with one of the most frightening horror films ever made, but rather with a celebration of the “ghost with the most.” With a new sequel now in theaters, we wanted to revisit Tim Burton’s original 1988 masterpiece, Beetlejuice! And since Beetlejuice features its own brand of both possession and exorcism, it offers a uniquely fun lens (specifically, the memorable dinner party scene soundtracked by the great Harry Belafonte) by which to investigate this terrifying concept…which has surprising roots in the real world.

So how in the heck did we get a genuine astrophysicist to investigate the reality (or unreality) of demonic possession? And what kind of story rules apply in a movie that is essentially a comedy with horror themes? And how does our special guest help guide Hakeem and Tamara through all of this? And just why are we calling this episode “Does it Fly After Dark” anyway?

The only way to find out is to check it out here or on our YouTube page!

SUGGESTED VIEWING 

You’ve seen Beetlejuice, right? It might just be Tim Burton’s best film. There’s also a sequel, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice (don’t say it a third time), also directed by Burton, currently in theaters, however we hadn’t seen that film at the time we recorded this episode. Now, while you can make the case that Beetlejuice is Burton’s best movie, we’re quite partial to his 1994 masterpiece, Ed Wood, which features Martin Landau as Bela Lugosi in a brilliant, Oscar-winning performance, so if you haven’t seen that, add it to your Halloween viewing list ASAP and thank us later.

But allow us to also suggest a few other movies about possession, albeit more traditional ones, to give you something else to worry about. Here they are, presented in the order in which we most highly recommend them.

The Exorcist

Directed by the great William Friedkin, it’s arguably the scariest movie ever made, one of the greatest horror movies of all time, and honestly one of the best movies of the 1970s. See it! (167 viewings optional, of course)

The Exorcist III

Generally speaking you can skip various Exorcist prequels and sequels…except this underrated gem. Directed by original Exorcist book author William Peter Blatty, it furthers the story of the original film with a little Zodiac Killer flavor thrown in for extra scares.

The Exorcism of Emily Rose

Notable in part for being loosely based on a real life case, it’s made even better by Scott Derrickson’s (Sinister, Doctor Strange) moody direction.

The Conjuring: The Devil Made Me Do It

While not the masterpiece of the first two Conjuring films, this one does once again follow real world paranormal investigators Lorraine and Ed Warren (Vera Farmiga and Patrick Wilson) in a dramatization of an actual case they were involved in. 

The Pope’s Exorcist

Notable primarily for Russell Crowe’s absolutely bonkers Italian accent as he portrays real-life Vatican exorcist Father Gabriel Amorth. We’ve loved director Julius Avery since 2018’s extremely underrated World War II zombie horror flick Overlord (which is better than this movie, so if you’ve only got time for one, that’s the one).

FURTHER READING 

Do you want to delve a little deeper into the facts, concepts, and stories Hakeem and Tamara referenced in today’s episode? Of course you do! 

“It ain’t so much the things we don’t know that get us into trouble…”

This favorite quote of Hakeem’s (which may or not actually be attributable to Mark Twain) came up in our episode about Back to the Future, as well! Some more scientific context for it can be found here.

Scientific papers on demonic possession

“This official review aims to clarify the current scientific understanding of the origins, mechanisms, and causes of these seemingly extraordinary experiences. Our analysis includes 52 documented cases of possession, reviewed from literature published between 1890 and 2023 and incorporating insights from psychology, medicine, anthropology, and theology. We examine common symptom patterns, delve into the research conducted, and evaluate how many cases are still unexplained within the existing behavioral science framework.”

You can read the scientific paper on demonic possession that Hakeem references in full here.

Marie Laveau 

Learn more about Hakeem’s famous (and magical) relative here.

The Psychiatry of Demonic Possession

“For the past two-and-a-half decades and over several hundred consultations, I’ve helped clergy from multiple denominations and faiths to filter episodes of mental illness — which represent the overwhelming majority of cases — from, literally, the devil’s work. It’s an unlikely role for an academic physician, but I don’t see these two aspects of my career in conflict. The same habits that shape what I do as a professor and psychiatrist — open-mindedness, respect for evidence and compassion for suffering people — led me to aid in the work of discerning attacks by what I believe are evil spirits and, just as critically, differentiating these extremely rare events from medical conditions.”

Read this fascinating article in full here.

The Oldest Depiction of a Ghost

Here’s the story behind that eerie Babylonian clay tablet referenced in Aaron’s discussion with Hakeem and Tamara.

Pazuzu

While best known as the “villain” of The Exorcist, Pazuzu might be getting a bad rep in pop culture. Or maybe not!

A much scarier Beetlejuice…

The darker, more horror-focused early development script for the film that Tamara talks about can be read here.

WANT MORE FROM DOES IT FLY?

We recently spoke with the showrunner of Netflix’s incredible new Terminator anime series, Terminator Zero. It’s a must watch for fans of the franchise.

Beetlejuice isn’t the first spooky topic we’ve tackled on our show. Check out our deep dive into the magical concepts of The Crow (the original, not that reboot nonsense)!

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