What really defines a cult—and why do smart, well-intentioned people get caught up in them? In this episode, Michael Shermer sits down with cult intervention specialist Ashlen Hilliard to explore the psychology of high-control groups and the people drawn into them. Her work has been featured in prominent media outlets like Hulu, NewsNation, HuffPost, and BET+.

In 2022, Ashlen founded People Leave Cults, offering intervention and recovery resources for survivors and concerned loved ones. As one of the few Cult Intervention Specialists in the country, Ashlen consults with a team of experts to develop personalized intervention strategies for families that have a loved one involved in a range of coercive situations, including cults, gangs, domestic violence, trafficking, and violent extremism. She also served as the Director of Events for the International Cultic Studies Association (ICSA), organizing regional and international events, workshops, and conferences for those affected by the cult phenomena and psychological manipulation.

She is touring the Fall of 2025 in these cities for her show https://www.psychologyofcults.com/:

October 8    Jacksonville, FL    Florida Theatre 
October 9    Newberry, SC    Newberry Opera House 
October 11    Huntsville, AL    Mars Music Hall 
October 12    Bristol, TN    Paramount Bristol 
October 14    Charleston, WV    Maier Foundation Performing Hall 
October 16    Stroudsburg, PA    Sherman Theater 
October 17    Morristown, NJ    Mayo Performing Arts Center 
October 18    Stamford, CT    Palace Theatre 
October 19    Concord, NH    Chubb Theatre 
October 21    Buffalo, NY    Electric City 
October 22    Columbus, OH    The Southern Theatre 
October 24    Pontiac, MI    Flagstar Strand Theatre 
October 26    Cincinnati, OH    Bogart's 
October 28    Chicago, IL    City Winery 
October 29    Indianapolis, IN    Clowes Memorial Hall 
October 30    Cleveland, OH    Connor Palace 
November 23 Livermore, CA    Livermore Valley Performing Arts Center