The Resilient Recruiter

For 20 years, Maria Sinclair watched other people get promoted while she stayed stuck in her own head. She questioned whether she belonged, worried about how she was perceived, and doubted nearly every decision she made. Then Covid hit, and everything changed. Cobalt furloughed 45 of its 55 UK staff, leaving only ten people working. Maria picked up multiple desks, supported clients across new specialisms, and kept the operation steady during one of the most challenging periods the industry had ever seen. That moment revealed a capability she had never fully recognised in herself. Today, Maria is the Managing Director of Cobalt, ranked 49th in the UK’s Hot 100 list based on GP per employee. After 23 years with the business, she has worked her way up from recruitment consultant to MD while helping build a culture known for tenure, trust, and consistent performance. In this conversation, Maria explains how she built confidence later in her career, why she focuses on job quality over call volume, how openness about challenges like perimenopause strengthens team culture, and how Cobalt hires for work ethic and trains for market expertise. If you have ever doubted whether you are ready to lead, this episode shows what becomes possible when you start backing yourself. You’ll learn: • How Maria entered recruitment after being rejected eight times • Why confidence took decades to develop • How she navigated the 2009 crash, Brexit, and Covid • Why the COVID-19 crisis became the turning point in her leadership • The cultural principles that support performance • Why job quality matters more than call volume • How Cobalt assesses work ethic and validates billings • The patience required to train recruiters from other sectors • Why expertise beats activity in the built environment Timestamps: [6:00] Breaking into recruitment after eight rejections [18:29] The confidence struggle [24:09] Navigating economic shocks [25:36] The Covid moment [28:49] The promotion that shifted everything [30:44] Being open about perimenopause [36:17] Culture and retention [41:37] KPIs that matter [50:18] Hiring for work ethic [54:29] Training recruiters from other sectors [58:13] Becoming an industry expert [1:01:06] Closing rate problems and what they mean Guest Bio: Maria Sinclair is the Managing Director of Cobalt, operating across the built environment with offices in the UK, Germany, and the US. Cobalt ranks 49th in Recruiter Magazine’s Hot 100 list based on GP per employee. Maria has been with Cobalt for 23 years and was appointed UK MD in January 2024.

What does it take to raise your fees, win better clients, and rebuild your recruiting business from the ground up? In this episode, I speak with Randee Staats, founder of S4 Search Partners, who went from losing everything — $250K in debt and $500 left — to rebuilding a seven-figure desk within the following year. Randee explains the decisions that nearly destroyed his business, the turning point that pushed him to rebuild, and the systems that rebuilt his confidence, his pipeline, and his profitability. He also breaks down the daily discipline, fee structure changes, and point-based productivity system that helped him win better clients and finally charge what he is worth. In This Episode, You'll Learn: How Randee launched his firm from his parents' basement The moment he landed a billion-dollar client The scaling mistake that cost him $250K Why he walked away from a $600K account How he raised his fees to 20 to 25 percent The script he uses to convert email replies into meetings The daily BD rhythm that rebuilt his pipeline The point system that keeps him consistent How he broke seven figures the year after rebuilding Episode Highlights 02:49 Discovering recruiting 05:04 Launching from the basement 09:35 The Jim Carrey check 13:15 Early success and hidden risks 14:18 The scaling mistake 17:16 The turning point 23:10 The weekly client call script 42:00 The wake-up call 44:14 New rules for pricing 46:47 The $30K placement 50:21 Daily planner 51:22 BD rhythm 1:03:09 The point system 1:07:33 Breaking seven figures Guest Bio Randee Staats is the founder of S4 Search Partners, based in New Jersey. He launched the firm in 2015, scaled a major national account to $600K, and later rebuilt his business from $500 and $250K in debt to seven-figure billings using a disciplined daily system and a new fee structure. LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/randee-staats/ Connect with Mark Whitby Free 30-minute strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwhitby/ Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Why do some recruiters struggle for traction while others build demand engines that bring clients to them? My guest, Tom Froggatt, made that shift after three days of calling 600 people with no results. Tom is the founder of Singular, a biotech search firm and one of Europe's leading specialists. Six months after launching the business, he hit a breaking point that changed everything. Instead of doubling down on cold calls, Tom built a system that creates predictable client demand. Today, a £4,000 campaign can generate £55,000 in revenue, and his business runs on consistent inbound opportunities. In this conversation, Tom explains how he replaced cold outreach with a system, how he uses content and insight reports to convert strangers into six figure clients, and why the volume required for effective marketing is far higher than most recruiters expect. In this episode, you'll discover Why Tom realised he did not have a BD problem but a systems problem How three days of rejection created a turning point How podcasting connected him with senior biotech leaders Why each client is worth £55,000 in 12 months How his insight report converts inbound retained work Why most recruiters underestimate the required volume How thinking like a tech founder beats thinking like a traditional recruiter Episode Highlights [6:44] Starting Singular in a windowless office and the six-month reality check [19:16] Three days, 600 calls, zero results. The moment everything changed [21:22] Launching "Careers in Discovery" and building relationships with senior biotech leaders [22:05] The podcast guest who walked Tom straight to HR and introduced him on the spot [36:44] The mindset shift from "winning clients" to building revenue-generating systems [42:16] Why each client is worth £55,000 in 12 months and what that means for ad spend [49:30] The exact funnel. Free insight reports that convert strangers into six-figure partnerships [54:14] Why Tom gives away £2,500 worth of market data for free and why it works [58:47] How to identify real client pain points without guessing [1:03:09] Why reverse engineering problems to fit your service always fails [1:10:27] The volume truth. Why 200 outreach attempts are not nearly enough If you want to build predictable client demand without relying on cold outreach, this episode will show you how. Guest Bio Tom Froggatt is the founder of Singular, a biotech search and talent company specialising in early drug discovery roles across Europe. Before Singular, Tom spent ten years at S3, where he opened their New York office at age 25. He is also the host of the Careers in Discovery podcast with more than 300 episodes. Connect with Tom LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/tom-froggatt Singular: https://book.singular-biotech.com/web Versapia website Connect with Mark Free strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/mwhitby Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Why do some recruitment founders build seven-figure businesses while others plateau despite working just as hard? My guest, Ollie Scott, discovered growth doesn't come from hustle alone. It comes from strategic bets. Ollie is the founder of Unknown, a talent growth consultancy that's worked with over 500 brands including Nike, Apple, and Disney. Six years ago, he started with £13,000 on a credit card and one mission: build the opposite of every recruitment company he'd ever seen. In this episode, Ollie shares his journey from rebellion to revenue. You'll hear why differentiation always beats trying to be the best, how scaling from 8 to 18 people nearly destroyed his business, and the three strategic bets he used to rebuild. You’ll Learn: • Why trying to be the “best” agency is a losing strategy • How Unknown defined a point of view clients cared about • What went wrong scaling from 8 to 18 people • Why profit is the safety net that enables innovation • How to build a productized recruitment offering • Why freelance talent pools are the future of recurring revenue • How recruiters can monetise M&A intelligence • How to price buy-side advisory at six-figure fees Episode Timestamps: [4:05] Selling suits to James Caan’s recruitment firm [10:23] Launching Unknown with £13,000 on a credit card [15:36] Naming strategy and brand distinctiveness [18:26] Writing a breakup letter to recruitment companies [21:44] Why rebellion works early but can’t scale [36:36] Productizing around three ICPs [44:03] Scaling to 18 people destroyed profit margins [48:34] Profit as psychological safety [53:20] Building recurring revenue through freelance talent pools [58:25] Why recruiters have more M&A intelligence than M&A firms Guest Bio: Ollie Scott is the founder of Unknown, a £3 million talent growth consultancy specialising in the global creative industry. Before launching Unknown, Ollie spent six years at Gemini People, joining the board in his early twenties. Unknown now operates across executive search, freelance talent pools, and M&A advisory for creative agencies. Connect with Ollie: LinkedIn: Ollie Scott Website: unknown.media Connect with Mark: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session linkedin.com/in/markwhitby Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

Why do some recruitment business leaders triple their revenue while others plateau despite working twice as hard? My guest, Martin Herbst, discovered the answer the hard way. After hitting rock bottom with burnout, he rebuilt his leadership philosophy from the ground up — and within five years, JobAdder tripled its revenue and client base. Martin is the CEO of JobAdder, one of the world’s leading recruitment technology platforms. Under his leadership, the company has achieved record growth while helping recruiters work smarter without losing the human touch. In this episode, Martin opens up about his personal experience with burnout and shares how he transformed that crisis into a leadership breakthrough. You’ll learn how he built a healthier, more effective approach to scaling a recruitment business one that’s rooted in purpose, values, and vision rather than constant hustle. He also breaks down the exact leadership frameworks that helped JobAdder grow sustainably: how to align your team around a clear long-term strategy, why empathy drives innovation, and how to balance big-picture vision with daily execution. Beyond leadership, Martin dives into how technology and AI are reshaping recruitment. He explains where automation genuinely creates value for recruiters, how to avoid the “AI hype trap,” and why human connection will always be the most powerful differentiator in this business. If you’ve ever struggled with overwhelm, exhaustion, or inconsistent growth, this conversation is a must-listen. Martin’s story is proof that scaling your business doesn’t require sacrificing your health or your values. In this episode, you’ll discover: How burnout became the catalyst for a breakthrough The daily habits that keep stress and anxiety in check Why swimming is Martin’s secret weapon for clarity and focus The strategy process behind JobAdder’s 5-year growth story Why most recruitment leaders underinvest in long-term planning How to use vision and values as your ultimate growth levers The fundamental role of AI in recruitment (and where it adds true value) Why the best BD technology is still the telephone Episode highlights: [6:44] The burnout story: high anxiety and insomnia that led to stepping away completely [11:17] Morning and evening borders: the simple habits that prevent burnout from creeping back [19:32] How JobAdder tripled revenue in five years, and why it wasn’t about working harder [23:31] Why most recruitment agency owners underinvest in strategy and long-term vision [32:29] Why recruitment might be the profession most immune to AI disruption [48:36] Why automation has created diminishing returns in outreach [53:59] The #1 business development tool that still outperforms AI Martin’s story is both a cautionary tale and an inspiring roadmap for recruiters who want to build high-performing, values-driven businesses that last. Guest Bio: Martin Herbst is the CEO of JobAdder, a global recruitment software company headquartered in Sydney, Australia. Under his leadership, JobAdder has tripled its revenue and client base in five years. Before joining JobAdder in 2020, Martin spent nearly seven years at eBay running their classifieds business in Australia (Gumtree). He also worked at eBay in San Francisco and at the Wall Street Journal online in digital media strategy. Originally from the United States, Martin now lives in Australia. Connect with Martin: LinkedIn: Martin Herbst on LinkedIn Website: JobAdder.com Connect with Mark: Get your free 30-minute strategy session: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session Mark on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/markwhitby Follow on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach

How does a professional touring musician go from the recording studio to building a $1.2M recruiting firm without ever making a single cold call? In this episode of The Resilient Recruiter, Justin Levinson, founder of Coming Up Creative, reveals how he blended creativity, authenticity, and smart systems to grow a seven-figure recruitment business serving the world’s top entertainment and gaming brands. Justin’s story is proof that success in recruitment isn’t about grinding harder - it’s about thinking differently. You’ll hear how he built a global team, automated outreach without losing the human touch, and turned every conversation into an opportunity. Listen to discover: How creative thinking helped Justin scale to $1.2M in billings The “anti-campaign” approach that fills his calendar with warm leads Why branding and design matter more in creative industries How to build trust, credibility, and inbound clients without cold calls The diversification strategy that kept his firm thriving through Hollywood strikes If you’ve ever wondered whether it’s possible to grow a high-performing recruiting business without endless prospecting, this episode is your blueprint. Connect with Justin Levinson LinkedIn: Justin Levinson Website: Coming Up Creative Connect with Mark Whitby FREE strategy session: www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn: Mark Whitby

The hardest part of business development isn't effort, it's consistency. Most recruiters know what to do, but struggle to do it every day while juggling clients, candidates, and placements. You know you should be reaching out to prospects daily, but between managing active searches, candidate interviews, and client meetings, your pipeline suffers. The solution? Build automated systems that generate leads while you focus on conversations that close deals. Giorgio Zanella is a go-to-market engineer who's built hundreds of automation workflows for recruiters and founders. Working out of Clay's New York office, he's spent three years mastering the platform and helping recruitment professionals scale their outbound without losing the personal touch. In this behind-the-scenes episode of The Resilient Recruiter, we break down the exact infrastructure, tools, and strategies you need to automate your outbound without sacrificing personalization or sounding like spam. This isn't theory. Giorgio has analyzed thousands of campaigns and knows exactly what separates automation that works from automation that gets ignored. You'll learn why Clay.com has become the number one platform for scaling outreach, how to choose the right tools for email and LinkedIn automation, what infrastructure you actually need (domains, inboxes, and warming protocols), and how to achieve 3-5% response rates on cold email when most people can't break 1%. We cover the complete tech stack: Clay for workflow automation and data enrichment, Instantly for email sequencing, HeyReach for LinkedIn automation, and how these tools work together to create synchronized multichannel campaigns. You'll discover how Clay's "waterfall enrichment" replaces expensive tools like ZoomInfo (saving you $15K+ per year), why LinkedIn outreach gets higher response rates than email (and its hidden limitations), and how to build email infrastructure that protects your domain reputation while scaling to hundreds of sends per day. Giorgio shares the exact formula for safe, sustainable outreach: 3-4 alternate domains, 2 inboxes per domain, 12-15 emails per inbox per day, and the two-week warming process you can't skip. He explains why most recruiters wreck their deliverability by sending from their main domain, how to set up synchronized campaigns where email, LinkedIn, and phone calls happen in coordinated sequences, and why relevance (right person, right time, right message) beats volume every single time. You'll learn what "good" response rates actually look like (spoiler: they're lower than you think, but the ROI is massive), how to calculate return on investment for cold outreach campaigns, and why even a 1% response rate can generate huge returns when your infrastructure costs are minimal. Giorgio breaks down why personalization and timing are more important than blast volume, how to track real-time signals like job changes and promotions to time your outreach perfectly, and the practical first steps to start automating your business development this month. This episode is part of our new course, Automate Your Outreach: How to Generate Client Leads Daily on Autopilot, a four-week implementation program where Mark and Giorgio guide you step-by-step through building your own automation system. Whether you're a solo recruiter trying to scale or an agency owner looking to systematize business development across your team, this conversation gives you the blueprint. Episode highlights: • [00:50] Introducing Giorgio Zanella and the vision behind the "Automate Your Outreach" program • [03:30] What is Clay and why recruiters are using it to automate lead generation • [07:35] The tech stack you actually need: Clay, Instantly, HeyReach (and what to skip) • [12:20] How to replace expensive data tools like ZoomInfo with Clay's "waterfall enrichment" • [18:40] Email vs. LinkedIn outreach: which gets more replies and why • [23:25] How to run synchronized multichannel campaigns (email + LinkedIn + phone) • [31:30] Why personalization and timing beat volume every time • [40:55] Building a bulletproof email infrastructure (domains, inboxes, warm-up rules) • [52:00] What "good" reply rates look like and how to calculate ROI on outreach • [1:10:00] Practical first steps to start automating your BD this month For more information or to register for the Automate Your Outreach course, visit recruitmentcoach.com/automate Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call: http://www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session/ Connect with Giorgio Zanella on LinkedIn Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Why do some recruiters struggle to break $300K while others hit seven figures in their third year? My guest, Tito Caceres, spotted a $160 billion industry that most recruiters have never even thought about. And he built a thriving business there with nothing but a credit card and relentless hustle. Tito grew up in his family's landscaping business and swore he'd never work in that industry. Ironically, that's exactly where he found his million-dollar niche. After building a career in sales and recruitment, he recognized an opportunity that others had completely missed. In 2021, he launched Bloom Talent Solutions and went all-in. First year? $600K in billings working solo with no agency pedigree. This year, he's on pace for $1.6 million. In this episode, you'll hear how Tito scaled fast by going retained-only, building a transparency system that keeps clients loyal, and creating new income sources beyond placement fees. You'll also hear why he fired clients to achieve clarity, how he packages candidates better than any resume ever could, and what it really takes to dominate a niche market. If you've ever wondered how far focus and follow-through can take a solo recruiter, this is your playbook. EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: How Tito went from despising the landscaping industry to building a million-dollar recruiting business in it First year billings: $600K working solo with no pedigree Why Tito walked away from contingent work in year two (and never looked back) The transparency system that keeps clients coming back: weekly reports, bi-weekly meetings, and QBRs Performance sheets: the mandatory tool that packages candidates better than any resume How Tito built AI-driven recruiting systems that put him miles ahead of other recruiters The subscription model that turns relationships into reliable income before placement fees even come in Hiring misfires, family challenges, and the painful lessons that led to clarity Revenue share partnerships with industry consultants that generate referrals on autopilot CONNECT WITH TITO CACERES: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tito-caceres/ Bloom Talent Solutions: http://getbloomtalent.com RESOURCES MENTIONED: Clay.com Lemlist Recruitment Coach Live Summit Claire Ackers on LinkedIn CONNECT WITH MARK WHITBY: Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call: https://www.recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session/ Mark on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwhitby/ Mark on Twitter: https://twitter.com/markwhitby Mark on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheRecruitmentCoach/ Mark on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/recruitmentcoach/ SUBSCRIBE TO THE RESILIENT RECRUITER This episode is a must-listen if you're ready to scale a high-profit, low-overhead search firm.

What if getting fired 20 times wasn’t failure, but the perfect preparation to build something meaningful? In this episode, recorded in London, I talk with James Rowe about what it really takes to build a six-figure solo recruitment practice without office rent, payroll, or management headaches. James shares how experienced recruiters can keep more of what they bill using smart systems, automation tools, and a resilient mindset. If you’ve ever thought about going solo or simplifying your business, you’ll get practical ideas you can apply right away. Timestamps 0:00 Intro 5:14 Getting fired 20+ times and discovering recruitment 13:15 From “terrible employee” to entrepreneur 14:01 The economics of solo recruiting 18:37 Why general recruiters struggle 24:33 Finding balance as a solo recruiter 29:02 Email and automation that work 40:54 Two email tweaks that boosted replies 20% 46:03 Lead magnets that convert at 50% 56:06 Why resilience and community matter most You’ll learn: How to structure your solo desk to scale without overhead The automation tools (Clay, ChatGPT, Phantom Buster) that win clients Why niche specialists thrive while generalists get squeezed The “Sent from my iPhone” follow-up trick that increases replies Why resilience and community matter more than talent The Resilient Recruiter brings you weekly conversations with top agency leaders, solo recruiters, and search-firm owners, hosted by Mark Whitby, coach and founder of RecruitmentCoach.com.

Most recruitment agency owners hit a wall around 10–20 people. The culture that made you successful starts to crack, and the personal touch gets lost. Nicholas Barton didn’t just avoid that wall he redefined what scaling could look like. From packing boxes in a warehouse to leading a 100-person global firm, Nicholas built The Barton Partnership into one of Forbes’ “World’s Best Management Consulting Firms,” with offices in London, New York, and Singapore. He built a platform before headcount, gave away 35% of his business through share options, and kept his early hires for nearly two decades. While competitors chased quick wins, Nicholas played the long game scaling internationally without losing the cohesion that made his business special. In this episode: [03:40] How Nicholas found his niche in strategy consulting [10:50] The “spray and pray” moment that launched his career [13:04] The hires who’ve stayed 18 years — and why [18:33] Why giving away 35% made his firm stronger [29:08] The “airport test” and how to hire for culture [35:20] Build your platform before you scale [1:04:42] Why great service always beats great selling 🎙️ Hosted by Mark Whitby, The Resilient Recruiter Podcast

AI isn't coming to recruitment. It's already here. And the gap between recruiters who know how to use it and those who don't is widening fast. My guest today has data proving it: recruiters adopting AI correctly are seeing up to 30% increases in GP per desk. Manan Shah is CEO and co-founder of Recruiter Flow, an AI-first recruitment operating system built for search firms, agencies, and solo practitioners doing permanent and contract placements. After accidentally discovering that recruitment agencies were "a decade behind" in tech adoption, Manan and his team have built what could be the most comprehensive AI-enabled platform for modern recruiters. This conversation gets tactical. We discuss how to run your firm with SaaS-level business intelligence, AI note-taking that structures unstructured data, job change alerts that put you in front of clients at exactly the right moment, and multichannel sequencing that lets you scale BD without adding headcount. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN: RecOps: Stop Guessing, Start Measuring Many recruitment firm owners are flying blind. They figure out salary budgets, marketing spend, and incentive structures by gut feel. Manan introduces "RecOps" (Recruitment Operations), borrowed from how SaaS companies run. It means tracking the metrics that matter. In SaaS, they know their customer lifetime value versus what they spend to acquire that customer should be 3:1. You should be spending one-third or less of what a client is worth to you on getting them. Simple, but many recruitment firms haven't made this calculation. Successful firms are now hiring operations people who aren't recruiters but keep the business running tight. Job Change Alerts: Three Opportunities From One Signal When someone in your database changes jobs or gets promoted, you get three plays. First, that person's new company often needs more hires or creates turnover when they bring in their own team. Second, their old company needs to backfill. Third, the one most people miss: that person was probably interviewing elsewhere. Build rapport, and they might tell you about the other positions they turned down. Those companies might still be hiring. Recruiter Flow monitors your database automatically and pings you when these changes happen. Multichannel Sequencing: Scale Your BD Without Adding Headcount Many agencies rely on their best billers to also do all the business development. They're making calls when they remember, sending one-off emails, maybe a LinkedIn message here and there. Nothing systematic. Recruiter Flow's multichannel sequencing lets you map out an entire BD campaign with conditional logic. Send a LinkedIn connection request. If they accept in 3 days, send a message. If not, trigger an email instead. If they open your email 3+ times but don't reply, the system creates a task for your recruiter to call them. This means your team can run sophisticated, persistent BD campaigns that would normally require hiring a dedicated BD person. EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS: How Manan accidentally discovered the recruiting agency market and why one client signed a 3-year contract after less than a year in business What "RecOps" means and why recruitment firms need to adopt SaaS-style business intelligence AI-first vs. AI-bolted-on and why your ATS needs to be rebuilt from the ground up The three categories of AI adoption: AI-native, AI-assisted, and AI-augmented How AI note-taking captures tribal knowledge and turns it into searchable intelligence Data enrichment built in: contact finder, job change alerts, executive appointment monitoring Why it's a triple opportunity when someone changes jobs MPC automation with branded landing pages and client interaction tracking What's next: 40+ AI agents in development and the ability to build your own custom agents Why AI doesn't just lift the average but widens the gap between top and bottom performers ABOUT MANAN SHAH: Manan Shah is CEO and co-founder of Recruiter Flow, serving thousands of customers globally, from solo practitioners to firms generating over $100M in annual revenue. Before founding Recruiter Flow in 2015, Manan built his first AI company in 2013, long before AI became mainstream. Connect with Manan on LinkedIn or visit recruiterflow.com CONNECT WITH MARK WHITBY: Get your free 30-minute strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/mwhitby Twitter: @MarkWhitby Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter for weekly insights on building a scalable, profitable recruitment business.

What happens when you sell a 100-employee company at 28 and decide freedom matters more than settling down? Lauren Fernandez didn’t just dream about working from anywhere—she made it a reality. But this isn’t a glossy “digital nomad” story. It’s the unfiltered truth about building a recruiting business while navigating serious health challenges, redefining success, and realizing your best life might look nothing like others expect. Lauren is the founder of Palm Coast Staffing, a legal recruiting practice she built while traveling the U.S. in an RV. After selling her first company with 100+ employees across three states, she and her husband skipped the mortgage and bought an RV instead. In this episode, Lauren reveals her three-section daily system that creates freedom through discipline, why she believes relationships beat cold calls, and how she structured her firm to keep running through unexpected crises. Episode Outline and Highlights [2:51] From selling rocks as a kid to building and selling a 100-employee company by age 28. [8:17] Hiring over 1,000 people—and what it taught her about matching success to the individual. [13:07] Rejecting the house for an RV and a new staffing business. [15:10] The unglamorous reality behind digital nomad life. [18:23] Her three-bucket daily planning system (no tech required). [23:19] An anti-cold calling philosophy: “find people where they are.” [27:59] Why returning to the same conferences builds long-term credibility. [34:42] Combating recruiting industry distrust through authentic relationships. [38:25] Running a business while navigating her husband’s serious health diagnosis. [44:52] Why entrepreneurial lows aren’t as devastating as you think—and highs aren’t as high. On Building a Business That Serves Your Life After selling her first company, Lauren chose differently. When her husband was later diagnosed with myositis and developed stage three heart failure, their flexible model proved its worth. In her words: “Success looks different for different people at different times. Maybe right now you’re in the building phase and you can work 12 hours a day, seven days a week. But maybe in a few years you’ve got kids and success is having freedom to spend time with them while they’re young.” She asks every agency owner to reflect: “Is your company the tool to get you success, or is your company the success? Is it the means to the end or is it the end?” Her System for Freedom Through Discipline Lauren’s three-section daily planning system is simple but effective. Using a paper planner, she breaks down daily into business development, recruiting, and operations. The buckets are interchangeable, so one disruption doesn’t derail the whole day. “When you run your own business, there’s a lot in the ‘other’ section,” Lauren says. This system helped her keep placing candidates and winning clients—even during week-long hospital stays. Her insight: discipline in planning is what creates the freedom to adapt. Lauren Fernandez Bio Lauren Fernandez is the founder of Palm Coast Staffing, specializing in legal recruitment nationwide. She previously co-founded and scaled a sales and marketing company to 100+ employees before selling it at 28. After agency experience in Florida, she and her husband launched Palm Coast Staffing in 2022 with a unique twist—building the business from an RV while traveling the country. Lauren has personally hired over 1,000 people, giving her deep insight into aligning opportunities with candidates’ life priorities. She’s passionate about rebuilding trust in recruiting through authentic relationships, not spammy outreach. Currently based in Florida, she continues to build Palm Coast Staffing while supporting her husband through ongoing health challenges. Their next adventure? An RV trip from Florida to Alaska. People and Resources Mentioned Atomic Habits by James Clear Hug Your Customers by Jack Mitchell "If—" poem by Rudyard Kipling Starlink Internet Airtable Recruit CRM ChatGPT Connect with Lauren and Mark Lauren on LinkedIn Palm Coast Staffing website Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call: RecruitmentCoach.com/strategy-session Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram

Most recruitment firms stall at $1M revenue. Greg Fischer broke through by building a high-retention offshore team, embedding himself inside client organizations with RPO, and using LinkedIn commenting as a smarter BD strategy. As Co-Owner of AMI Network, Greg scaled from $1M to $4.2M revenue and $1.4M profit sustaining 30–40% margins. His model: hire offshore staff directly, integrate them as equals, and use a 2:1 sourcer-to-recruiter ratio to free recruiters to bill more. Alongside that, he mastered RPO pricing, transforming a $30K placement into a $1.5M account. Today, as founder of Well Oiled Machine, Greg helps other firms replicate this approach. In this episode, he shares how to structure offshore teams for 85%+ retention, qualify RPO opportunities, and win clients through LinkedIn commenting. Episode Outline and Highlights 6:42 From solo founder’s first hire to 40-person team. 7:40 Breaking the $1M ceiling with offshore hiring after failed BPOs. 12:37 Why sourcing was the first offshore function and how it lifted billings. 23:18 Landing a $50K/month RPO by reframing a client’s hiring challenge. 28:07 How that grew into an $80K/month RPO account with 30–40% margins. 30:45 When to pitch RPO: the minimum job volume that makes it viable. 33:47 The “open + close” fee model that stabilized cash flow. 36:23 How a 2:1 sourcer-to-recruiter ratio frees recruiters to bill more. 39:08 Why most agencies fail with offshore—and how to do it right. 47:19 Choosing the right country: Mexico vs Philippines vs South Africa. 54:51 Greg’s daily LinkedIn commenting routine that built an inbound pipeline. Key Takeaways Offshore Done Right Fuels Scale Greg’s agency was stuck at $1M for four years. BPOs failed, freelancers flaked. The breakthrough came when he hired offshore staff directly, trained them thoroughly, and treated them as equals. Within three years, AMI scaled to $4M+ revenue with 30–40% profit margins and 85% retention. Offshore wasn’t a cheap fix; it was the lever that freed recruiters to focus on revenue-driving work. The RPO Question That Unlocks Recurring Revenue A referral asked for an internal recruiter. Greg’s partner asked: “Why now?” The answer—50 hires in six months—turned a $30K placement into a $50K/month retainer that ran three years, worth $1.5M. His rule: RPO only works with 5–10 requisitions/month and $15K+ revenue. Anything less is contingent search. Over time, he moved to an “open fee + closed fee” model that kept revenue flowing and profit margins at 30–40%. LinkedIn Strategic Commenting Works Greg built AMI Network through cold outbound. For Well Oiled Machine, he went another route: commenting daily on posts from 60 recruitment thought leaders. Thirty minutes before posting, thirty minutes after. The results? Comments hitting 20,000+ impressions—often outperforming original posts. On LinkedIn, comments are content, and for agency owners this is a repeatable, low-cost BD strategy that beats cold calling. Greg Fischer Bio and Contact Info Greg is the former Co-Owner of AMI Network, a healthcare recruitment agency that did $1.4M in Profit on just $4.2M in revenue. His secret? 18 of his 40 team members were Offshore high-performing employees, with annual retention over 85%. Now his firm, Well Oiled Machine recruits Offshore & Nearshore staff for Recruitment Firms & Staffing Agencies. Greg Fischer on LinkedIn Well Oiled Machine website link Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Andy Dunne thought other agency owners were the enemy. They'd steal clients, poach candidates, copy ideas. Sound familiar? Then he joined Team in 2014 just to save £130 a month on job boards. Eleven years later, he's their managing director, overseeing 500+ agencies that split over £6 million in fees last year. What changed? Andy learned that protecting everything actually kills more business than it creates. In this episode, you'll discover: Why 80% of Team's agencies went from generalist to specialist since 2014 (and why the generalists are getting crushed) The market intelligence strategy that makes prospects call you instead of you chasing them How two specialist agencies split £40,600 by collaborating on out-of-niche roles The mental health reality of running an agency alone - and why Andy champions this cause Why your real competition isn't other agencies, but AI and managed service providers Andy shares the quarterly report strategy that made one agency owner "untouchable" with prospects, the collaboration mindset shift that's transforming the industry, and why the isolation of solo agency ownership is something that can't be ignored. Whether you're a solo agency owner or leading a team, this conversation challenges the "protect everything" mentality and shows how collaboration can transform your business. Andy Dunne is Managing Director of Team, the UK's largest network of independently owned recruitment businesses. With over 20 years in recruitment, including running his own agency, Andy is passionate about collaboration and community. Since joining Team, he's helped agencies save millions in job board costs and connect through an active network that shares over £6m annually in split fees.

What if you could run your recruiting firm on autopilot while launching a completely new business? Brian Gabay has mastered this balance—his 5-person team makes placements without him while he builds a tech startup. Brian founded Brian Simon Associates (BSA) in 2016, specializing in PR and marketing recruitment. He built systems, transforming his business from constant attention to running independently. This freedom allowed him to launch Arrange AI, eliminating interview coordination, which consumes 70% of recruiters' admin time. Brian reveals his framework: getting your entire team on client calls, his "hire two people" strategy, and the mindset shift to step away from daily operations. Plus, surviving a 6-month placement drought taught him the resilience needed to juggle multiple ventures. Episode Outline and Highlights [7:19] The reality TV opportunity that came at the worst time [8:11] How a 3-year kidney donor search taught him resilience [19:50] Why are placed candidates overlooked for new business [20:27] Daily LinkedIn habit: One new connection PLUS one reconnection [23:40] Surviving the drought: First placement took 5-6 months [26:14] The 6-month cash cushion rule for going solo [36:35] Hiring strategy: "If you like two people, hire them both." [44:27] Why 70% of recruiting time is wasted on scheduling [50:18] Game-changer: Getting your entire team on client calls [52:58] Building systems: "Placements happen without me" Building Through Setbacks Brian's approach to adversity was forged through personal crisis. With his father on dialysis, Brian applied recruiting skills to find a kidney donor. "I wasn't a blood match. Neither were my sisters. He's type O... I searched for three years. There was a dark world out there. People wanted money... My dad's life is on the line." The breakthrough came through Jennifer Wolf, who responded to his outreach "just like we would do on LinkedIn." When Fox discovered his YouTube video and offered him a spot on "Home Free" to compete for a house for Jennifer, the timing couldn't have been worse. The 6-Month Rule Brian's practical approach began with planning: "I saved enough to pay rent for six months. That was my cushion... I need to make a placement within six months. If I can't, then maybe this is not for me." His advice emphasizes transparency: "If you're starting your own firm and leaving your current one, have a transparent conversation... Even if these are connections you made yourself, it was created under someone else's umbrella. Leave on good terms." From Solo to Scale After three years solo, Brian began building a team. When he discovered an employee ignoring candidate emails, instead of retreating, he refined his approach: "Out of 10 people, if there's two you really like and you're on the fence, hire both. If one doesn't work out, you still got a really good one." The transformation came from one change: "Having them involved in all client calls... Now if it's a new business call, it's all five of us. They meet the client, ask questions, take notes... I've seen the ownership kick in." This freed Brian to launch Arrange while BSA operated: "Sometimes there's placements being made and I'm not involved at all." Brian Gabay Bio Brian Gabay founded BSA in 2016, specializing in PR, Marketing, and Digital/Social recruiting. He's partnered with recognized PR agencies and brands nationwide. With over a decade of experience, Business Insider named him one of the top PR recruiters in the country. Earlier this year, he launched Arrange AI—a smart scheduling tool for recruiters coordinating meetings between external parties. Brian on LinkedIn Arrange AI: arrange.ai BSA: briansimonsassociates.com Resources Mentioned "Home Free" on Fox Tim Tebow on LinkedIn Connect with Mark Whitby FREE strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session LinkedIn | Twitter: @MarkWhitby Facebook | Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Johnny Campbell drops a bombshell: "Can AI recruit better than humans today? Hundred percent better than humans on average." He's got the data to back it up. Johnny explains why half of all recruiters will be gone within the next decade—and how to be in the half that thrives. Johnny runs SocialTalent and has trained over a million recruiters globally. He survived launching an agency during the 2008 crash and now shares what's coming next. Episode Outline and Highlights [3:35] How Johnny survived launching an agency into the 2008 crash [8:37] "Peak recruiter" happened in 2023—why it's downhill from here [10:41] The bank loan analogy that destroys the case for human interviewers [15:05] The AirPods story—why candidates will accept AI interviews [19:33] UK research: AI persuades people 10x better than humans [28:10] Marc Andreessen's "barbell model"—why the middle dies [31:24] Indian recruiters abandoned email—what WhatsApp means for outreach [36:26] Mercor: Three 21-year-olds built a $2B AI recruiter in 2 years [38:14] The Hudson RPO arbitrage—selling AI to companies that can't use it [52:07] Why recruiters need Johnny's "Mini MBA" Key Takeaways: Your $2 Billion Wake-Up Call: Three 21-year-olds started Mercor two years ago. Now valued at $2 billion. Their pitch: "5 qualified candidates in 5 minutes." They didn't improve recruiting—they eliminated it. Where AI Wins: Johnny breaks recruiting into three parts. Finding candidates? AI wins. Assessment? AI does it better with less bias. But closing deals? That's where humans matter. "There will always be a role for a human advising the business." No Middle Ground: McDonald's hires in 7 minutes with AI. Zuckerberg personally calls candidates. If you're doing "decent recruiting at decent prices," you're dead. Pick a side: tech-powered efficiency or ultra-premium service. The WhatsApp Revolution: Email is dead for recruiting in India. Everyone uses WhatsApp. Johnny's insight: AI will soon predict the best platform per candidate. Agencies sending LinkedIn InMails are playing yesterday's game. Johnny Campbell Bio and Contact Info Johnny Campbell is the co-founder and CEO of SocialTalent. With over 250,000 LinkedIn followers, he's recognized globally as a thought leader on AI and recruitment. Father of 4 boys, avid runner, aspiring youth rugby coach. Johnny on X Johnny on LinkedIn Johnny on Instagram SocialTalent website link SocialTalent on Facebook SocialTalent on YouTube People and Resources Mentioned Mercor website link Glen Cathey on LinkedIn Hudson RPO website link Clay website link ChatGPT  Copilot Gemini Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Most recruitment agencies waste £50+ per cold call meeting. Anthony Lewis found a better way to scale from startup to 50-person team. Anthony's team made 1,500 cold calls for just 27 placements. That 1.8% conversion rate would panic most agency owners. Instead, he built a candidate experience system that turns rejections into revenue. What You'll Learn: How to build agency growth without expensive cold calling Business development strategies that actually work How 86% candidate satisfaction became his competitive advantage Agency scaling secrets from startup to 50 employees Why treating candidates like future clients changes everything Key Insights: 9:39 Why purpose prevents fee-chasing behavior 24:53 What "psychological safety" means for performance 35:30 Why individual KPIs beat generic targets 45:43 The candidate feedback system that drives growth 50:26 How the MD personally calls every unhappy candidate Anthony Lewis Bio and Contact Info  Anthony is passionate about the careers of public sector leaders, and for over a decade has supported organisations nationally to attract and hire the best talent. Whether interims, Non Execs or people into permanent roles, Anthony is never happier than when helping people fulfil their career ambitions.  Anthony is Managing Director at Tile Hill, a public sector-focused executive recruitment company, and is hugely proud of the achievements of the business and those around him. From having been awarded Best Company to Work For, Best In House L&D at the 2024 REC Awards, the Best Candidate Experience category at the 2024 Tiara Awards, and most recently voted the number 1 interim service provider in the Institute of Interim Management Annual Survey, it is a reflection of the values led approach and passion that Tile Hill's team show as they approach their work every day. With an EVP of #Lovetheimpactyou make, we are all inspired to make a difference for those who are shaping the society we live in. • Tile Hill website link Anthony Lewis on LinkedIn Different Leadership website link Tile's fundraiser for Alzheimer's Society People and Resources Mentioned David Weir on LinkedIn Leo Hewett on LinkedIn  Force24 JobAdder Adecco Group Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

Fired in 3 days, Dario Furman rebounded to bill $6.5M. Learn his recruitment growth strategies using relationships, niche focus & AI. Fired three days into his first recruiting job, Dario Furman could have walked away. Instead, a bold “second chance” email to the CEO got him rehired and launched a 17-year executive search career placing 500+ professionals and billing $6.5M at StevenDouglas. In this episode of The Resilient Recruiter, Dario shares how resilience, relationship-building, and smart use of AI helped him become one of Florida’s top billers. You’ll learn how he turned candidates into loyal clients, outworked his competition, and built a sustainable desk focused on quality, not transactions. You’ll discover: The comeback story that began with a “second chance” email. How Dario became a top 3 national biller within a year. Overcoming fear of business development and calling C-suite decision-makers. Turning long-term candidate relationships into client revenue. Why did he “MPC’d” himself into StevenDouglas? Leveraging niche focus, KPIs, AI tools, and warm introductions to boost results. Automations that enhance, not replace, human connection. About Dario: Dario connects top-tier finance and accounting talent with South Florida’s leading companies. Since joining StevenDouglas in 2014, he’s placed 387 professionals with an 8% falloff rate, generating over $6.4M in fees. Fluent in English and Spanish, he combines modern recruiting tools with an old-school relationship-first approach. People and Resources Mentioned: James Cairns on LinkedIn ChatGPT  Herefish  Quil AI Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

What if your job board wasn’t just a place to post jobs—but the top of your sales funnel? In this episode of The Resilient Recruiter, Jordan Whilden shares how he scaled Ministry Hub, a faith-based executive search firm, by transforming a niche job board into a predictable lead generation machine. Fueled by a cold email campaign that delivers a 17% reply rate, Jordan’s model shows how recruiters can generate clients consistently—without cold calling or high-pressure tactics. We dive into the exact steps Jordan took to build a multi-service recruitment business, from his transition out of pastoral ministry to launching a proprietary ATS (MinistryHire) and leading a fully remote team. If you’re a recruitment agency owner looking to build smarter systems, offer tiered services, or grow recurring revenue, this episode is packed with actionable ideas and inspiration. Episode Highlights: From full-time ministry to launching a job board side hustle Evolving from job board to full-service search firm First-year lessons: underpricing, overwhelm, and early wins Why building a custom ATS was a game-changer Creating flexible, tiered service models How “serve first” creates long-term client wins Cold outreach strategy: 89% open rate, 17% replies The tools behind his tech stack: Loxo, Instantly, Hireflix, Asana, Scribe Scaling with a 3-person offshore team One-way video interviews and standout candidate presentation Recurring revenue through subscription-based ATS Leading with values while balancing family and business growth Key Takeaways: A job board can be more than a job board—it can be your client magnet Value-first cold emails build trust before selling Scaling is easier with systems, SOPs, and the right offshore support Serving your niche exceptionally well creates both impact and revenue About Jordan Whilden: Jordan is the founder and CEO of Ministry Hub, a faith-based executive search firm. With a Master’s in Theology and an MBA, he brings a rare mix of pastoral insight and business acumen. Prior to launching Ministry Hub in 2021, Jordan served churches on both coasts, including leadership at one of America’s largest congregations. He’s also the creator of MinistryHire, a purpose-built ATS and job board platform serving mission-driven organizations. Today, Jordan helps churches and nonprofits build world-changing teams—and has grown Ministry Hub into a go-to talent partner in the faith sector. He lives in Chapel Hill, North Carolina, with his wife Brittany and their son. Outside work, they love kayaking, the beach, and traveling as a family. Connect with Jordan: Jordan on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordanwhilden/ Ministry Hub Website - https://ministryhub.org/ MinistryHire Website - https://ministryhire.com/ Connect with Mark Whitby: Get a FREE strategy call: recruitmentcoach.com/strategy-session Mark on LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/mwhitby/ X: @MarkWhitby Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter - https://plinkhq.com/i/1489513354

Tired of the outdated “thirds” model in executive search? Andrew Mears was too. That’s why he co-founded Lead Candidate—a niche search firm serving the pharma and bio-outsourcing sector—based on a transparent, fixed-fee subscription model that’s up to 30% more cost-effective than traditional pricing. In this episode, Andrew reveals how Lead Candidate went from break-even to 133% revenue growth by rethinking everything: pricing, positioning, sales, and even internal rituals like “Tom’s Day of Bad Ideas.” You’ll hear how they grew entirely through referrals—no cold calls, no job scraping, no outbound—and why clients commit to 3–18 month subscription agreements that provide predictable revenue for the firm and budgeting certainty for their CFOs. If you're a recruitment firm owner frustrated with unpredictable billings, client churn, or the limitations of contingent search, this conversation will show you what’s possible when you lead with values, relevance, and partnership—not pitches. Episode Highlights [3:24] Why Andrew left a COO role to start over during COVID—and how a health scare changed his outlook [12:22] The broken search pricing model—and how Lead Candidate built a better one [22:30] Defining a niche within a niche: how their positioning sets them apart [31:55] Capsule vs. Scale vs. Annual Subscription: how their pricing tiers work [43:39] Why they broke even for 2 years—then tripled revenue during a downturn [56:42] How they land clients without cold outreach [1:08:06] Tom’s Day of Bad Ideas: the internal ritual that drives innovation [1:19:20] How they’re using AI tools like Quill to free up human interaction Why This Subscription Model Works Instead of charging a percentage of salary in staged fees, Lead Candidate scopes each project based on hiring volume, role complexity, and delivery effort. Pricing is fixed, agreed upfront, and delivered via subscription—typically 3, 6, or 12+ months. This approach gives clients cost transparency and spending predictability—especially valuable for VC-backed, resource-constrained companies—and positions Lead Candidate as a strategic partner rather than a transactional vendor. No Cold Calls, Just Clients Lead Candidate didn’t rely on cold outreach. Before launching, Andrew’s team surveyed the market, co-created their offer with prospects, and built deep trust through relevance and listening. Their early clients didn’t need convincing—they were already bought in. “We never sold. We just listened. The worst outcome was a great conversation.” This approach helped them create a high-conviction pipeline, long-term client relationships, and sticky recurring revenue—without chasing unqualified leads or relying on outdated biz dev tactics. A Values-First Growth Story The journey wasn’t easy. For the first two years, they broke even. But Andrew and his co-founders stayed true to their niche, hired with care, and grew by reputation. By 2024, the firm had grown 133% in revenue and 250% in headcount—without compromising on culture or delivery quality. “We built the business the market told us it needed—and just stayed true to it.” About Andrew Mears Andrew is the CEO of Lead Candidate, a search firm he co-founded in 2020 to champion talent in the global life sciences sector. He began his career in HR before moving into executive recruitment, where he’s spent 16+ years building national and international practices. Connect with Andrew on LinkedIn Visit Lead Candidate People and Resources Mentioned Quill AssistCV (by Odro) ChatGPT “Buy Back Your Time” by Dan Martell “Built to Sell” by John Warrilow “Molecule to Market” Podcast Connect with Mark Whitby Book a free strategy call Mark on LinkedIn @RecruitmentCoach on Instagram @MarkWhitby on Twitter