675 How to Live a Kick-Ass Life with Andrea Owen
Update: 2024-12-26
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On today’s episode, I’m chatting with Andrea Owen to explore the journey of self-discovery, the nuances of personal growth, and the vital role of vulnerability in relationships. Andrea shares how the re-release of her book, 52 Ways to Life a Kick-Ass Life, addresses personal growth, toxic positivity, and the role of shame in our unwanted behavior patterns. Plus, she tells us how we can use genuine vulnerability to get the help and connection we need!
Read the show notes for today's episode at terricole.com/675
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Transcript
00:00:00
Oh, well hello there, and welcome to this episode of the Terry Cole show.
00:00:05
So glad you're here.
00:00:05
I just had an amazing conversation with one of my friends Andrea Owen and She is a keynote speaker.
00:00:11
She's a life coach.
00:00:12
She's an author.
00:00:13
She's kind of a hell of a razor in her own little way.
00:00:15
She is creating a global impact in women's empowerment with her books being translated into 19 languages and available in 23 countries.
00:00:23
She helps high achieving women maximize unshakeable confidence, master their mindset, and magnify their courage.
00:00:30
Yeah, that's what we talked about all of those things.
00:00:33
And she just re-released a book of hers that I really loved called 52 ways to live a kick-ass life and it's all updated, new tools,
00:00:43
challenges, fresh insights, right?
00:00:44
Because the first one I think she wrote in 2011, so it really is updated.
00:00:49
So we talked everything about confidence, about people pleasing, about effective communication, about recovery, about her background, some of my background.
00:00:58
So I hope that you enjoy this interview with Andrea Owen as much as I enjoyed interviewing her.
00:01:03
This is the Terry Cole show and as you might have guessed,
00:01:16
I'm your host, Terry Cole.
00:01:18
For over two decades, I've been a licensed psychotherapist, love and boundaries expert, and I'm also the founder of the Real Love Revolution and Boundary Bootcamp.
00:01:27
On this show, I'll bring you simple strategies based on practical psychology, inspiring expert interviews, and my own insights and observations from my time on the front lines in the fascinating world of entertainment,
00:01:40
empowerment, and mental health.
00:01:41
Now let's get going with today's episode.
00:01:44
Wow, I'm super excited to welcome back kind of second, third time, fourth time.
00:01:51
I don't know, it's because this show has been on.
00:01:55
We've been friends for a long time, this season, I'm for a long time.
00:02:01
Andrea Owen, welcome back to the Terry Cole show.
00:02:03
Thank you so much, Terry.
00:02:05
I'm so excited to come be back.
00:02:07
I'm so glad you're here.
00:02:08
All right.
00:02:09
So many things to talk about.
00:02:11
First of all, let's talk a little bit about your own trajectory into doing what you're doing, like what set you up to be this master life coach and doing all the stuff that you've been doing.
00:02:25
Tell us a little bit about what you do and like sort of if you were a Marvel movie character, what would your origin story be?
00:02:33
My hero's journey.
00:02:37
Well, and I think it's if you're going to talk about that, I think from a child, I've always been sort of the a seeker, but back then I didn't know what that was.
00:02:49
I always wanted to talk about the elephant in the room, and I knew something existed, but I didn't know what it was, just this discomfort.
00:02:57
Decades later I found out it was oh feelings and emotions and like what's there and the hard parts and things like that.
00:03:03
And as a as a Gen Xer, it just wasn't, you know, a thing.
00:03:07
So fast forward, I got married to someone I'd been with for since I was a teenager, we didn't have a whole lot of skills and that relationship ended up ending very badly with infidelity and gaslighting and all these things that many of us walk through.
00:03:22
And that really is what my life totally fell apart.
00:03:26
Then I dated a con man and it was a nightmare and I had like an existential crisis and a moment of like what why?
00:03:34
But also had to wear with all to know that it starts with me because I'd been blaming everybody else and like putting all my eggs in their basket.
00:03:42
So that's what started my both my personal and professional trajectory and that was around 2006.
00:03:49
Wow.
00:03:50
So a lot has happened since then, but it really it was a moment that brought me to my knees, which I don't think everyone has to get to that point, but it was my experience and forced me to really kind of look in the mirror.
00:04:00
Like what I have control over.
00:04:02
And that's where I started.
00:04:03
It's such a all over story.
00:04:06
Do you know what I mean?
00:04:06
Like not to say it's not unique to you.
00:04:08
Of course it is.
00:04:09
But I think that part of what you do in the books that you write and actually say we're going to be talking about the newly re-released book, which is, you know, 52 ways to live a kick ass life.
00:04:19
I love it so much.
00:04:21
In the book is about how can you help others?
00:04:25
Yeah, not have to do it that way.
00:04:29
Let's say, you know, when I always feel the same way with the really painful experiences that I've had.
00:04:33
I hope that what I'm writing about it and sharing about it so that you could learn from the pain that I had and maybe you don't.
00:04:43
It maybe it all doesn't have to go down like a shit show.
00:04:45
You know what I mean?
00:04:45
Exactly.
00:04:47
That's my hope.
00:04:48
Yeah.
00:04:48
And that's my hope that I can turn my pain and trauma and healing to as a gift to others.
00:04:52
And I think, you know, that's many of us who come on these podcasts.
00:04:55
That's our goal.
00:04:57
Yes.
00:04:58
So what inspired you now to re-release 52 ways to live a kick ass life, which I loved in its original incarnation, which was 2013.
00:05:07
So I know it's been fully updated with new tools and new challenges, fresh insights.
00:05:12
But why, why the update?
00:05:14
A few reasons.
00:05:16
The most obvious one is as I wrote it in, you know, 2011, 2012.
00:05:22
It was released in 20 or late 2013 or really 2014.
00:05:25
It was a different time back then.
00:05:28
And that, for example, like one of their very first chapters.
00:05:30
I'm talking about how, you know, you're solely in charge of your reality and your thoughts create your destiny and things like that.
00:05:39
And that's just simply not true.
00:05:42
I've grown as a, as a woman and as a professional as an expert in this field.
00:05:47
And there are certain things that were to put it very directly like toxic positivity.
00:05:53
It was peppered in.
00:05:55
And it was just sort of the thing that kind of like, it was just bothered me over the years.
00:05:59
And so 10 years went by and we contacted the publisher.
00:06:02
And that was really the main thing.
00:06:04
And they said, yes.
00:06:06
And so, you know, it's like, while we're here, let's, let's add some tools of things that I learned, you know, we've had enormous social unrest and political change and new topics that are relevant in the field of personal growth.
00:06:19
And specifically around women's empowerment that I wanted to address.
00:06:22
And sort of like also take responsibility for.
00:06:26
And I do that in the introduction.
00:06:27
And because I think that everyone grows and learns and changes for the better.
00:06:32
And I wanted to, to point to that that all of us do.
00:06:36
And to take responsibility for it.
00:06:38
That's actually great.
00:06:40
And it's, it's funny.
00:06:41
It's like the world has changed so much since them.
00:06:44
And you've changed.
00:06:46
Yeah, so much since them.
00:06:47
So it's kind of great that you get a chance to sort of go back and be like, OK, well, this is what I would think about that.
00:06:52
Now it's funny.
00:06:53
I look at my earlier writing.
00:06:55
And when I was writing 15 years ago, I was like, so fucking sure.
00:07:00
I was so goddamn positive of like everything, you know.
00:07:06
And it's so interesting to see as I've matured and grown up more how I'm, I'm a lot less sure.
00:07:13
I'm more like, Hey, maybe, maybe it's my way.
00:07:16
But I look back and I think that there's a certain I agree with you.
00:07:22
There's a certain amount of almost like hubris where like, what was I thinking when I wrote like, this is a factor.
00:07:30
Like, is it though?
00:07:31
I'm not sure it is.
00:07:32
OK, so let's talk about stuff in the book that of course is all still relevant and we are still dealing with this stuff.
00:07:39
Let's first just talk about toxic positivity.
00:07:42
Yeah, let's just get into it.
00:07:44
I am inherently a cheerleader.
00:07:46
It's why I decided to become a life coach instead of a therapist back many, many years ago is because what I'm really good at is motivating and inspiring and the energy and enthusiasm that I bring is true to my nature and part of my purpose.
00:08:01
So that can be true.
00:08:03
Like, I can be the consummate cheerleader and help people just feel alive about the changes that they're about to make because it can feel kind of heavy and serious and scary.
00:08:13
So I still believe in that.
00:08:16
I still believe in just women's empowerment in general and at the same time and we write the answer to your question comes in is we as leaders in the field need to also acknowledge everyone's experience.
00:08:32
So for me to toxic positivity might say like it doesn't matter what your circumstances are.
00:08:39
You can heal from your trauma in six months if you use my program like well.
00:08:47
Not everyone.
00:08:48
Some people there is neurodiversity.
00:08:51
Some people grow up without the resources and support that other people have.
00:08:57
It just things like that just I mean even talking about different races and and and genders and sexualities and and how that matters in terms of the resources that we have and everything and access right when you think about it.
00:09:13
If you're looking at really acknowledging our own privilege and being like we have a certain level of access that I agree with you we can't come from the point of view that assumes everyone does.
00:09:28
Because we live in a racist society and that's not true, but not everyone does.
00:09:33
So I think yes on that with toxic positivity, but I also you know there's another sort of form of toxic positivity that you I know you write about in the book where people can't stop like being a silver lining detective no matter what has happened.
00:09:48
Yeah, it's it's the it can feel when so to yes more on that it's where a whether it's a friend or an author or whomever is is the advice is to always look at the bright side well at least it didn't happen this way well it could have been worse and that's really never helpful you know the silver lining is I think very specific and and there's a lot of nuance to it.
00:10:17
It can be helpful, but there's a lot of nuance, but if you're talking about just sort of on the surface it can be dismissive and insulting to people who have particular circumstances or even people who experience neuro diversity you know there are some there are some habits that we talk about in personal growth.
00:10:36
That yes they can be solved or the cause of them is because of X Y and Z but a lot of times it's because this is how your brain works you know like and it and it took me you know one of my children was diagnosed with autism when they were five and also anxiety and ADHD and then that and I was like looking at my own stuff and my own diagnosis and I'm like oh well sometimes it's not that easy of just doing the steps that you and I prescribe and having the outcome be a certain way.
00:11:05
So it's just about acknowledging the nuances not allowing it to be an out for people to stay stuck but just acknowledging it can be helpful.
00:11:17
Yes totally and I also think that so much of the time if someone has a problem or immediate things to say like you just said it could be worse or you know other people have it worse or whatever that's not for that person that is for us.
00:11:34
We are uncomfortable with their pain so we feel compelled to say something positive but in a way it's it's really denying or minimizing the other person's feeling there's another word though it's invalidating can be invalidating where someone's trying to talk about whatever is going through so I'm not saying you know let people chronically endlessly complain all over you that's not good for your brain or anything but there is something about learning to tolerate when other people don't have the answers for themselves or when they're in pain and not treating people like projects.
00:12:15
Yes and I think that for anyone listening or watching this who who was like who that's me like I'm the person that chronically tries to fix it or I put a silver lining on it and you know before you go and beat yourself up.
00:12:27
Look at where you can't be with your own feelings that mirror that other persons because and I say this all the time I couldn't be with other people's emotions because I could not be with my own.
00:12:42
I was judgmental towards other people like why can't you just get yourself together you know just right because it's how you know that's the voice that I heard growing up and it was it wasn't until I got sober in 2011 which you and I have talked about where I was.
00:12:58
I mean it's kind of forced like I was just going to say it.
00:13:03
There's difference between recovery and sobriety and when I was when I was in recovery and really truly looking at like my sticking points and it was feelings and that was where I thought oh okay this is why I'm just connected in my relationships.
00:13:18
Right do your own work before you try to do somebody else's yes yes and that's really the whole thing about think about how much we've been trained though to focus on others.
00:13:29
In the way of pleasing others right so we can move it into people pleasing or perfectionism but all that really in the book you talk about it this way because it's true it's really a need for control and that that's what we're talking about so what are your thoughts about if people go okay.
00:13:47
Definitely a people please are definitely a perfectionist where could I even start yeah to change those behaviors what would your thoughts be.
00:13:56
I immediately want to jump way into the deep end I call it the seven layer dip like let's go all the way down.
00:14:02
I'm obsessed with the root of the problem and for a long time and you know when I wrote the first edition of this book I was certain that the root of the problem was self talk.
00:14:15
You can solve that if you can learn to speak a new language essentially easy easy you solve the problem what I quickly realized that that there was still a sticking point for people what is that.
00:14:25
So then in 2014 I went and got trained in the methodology of Brane Brown's work and it was around shame and shame resilience to be more specific.
00:14:33
That is the root of the problem so anytime someone is engaging in and I don't want to say anytime because you know then we're then we're falling into certainty many times when we are engaging in perfectionism.
00:14:44
People pleasing control and a lot of times even things like over achieving numbing out isolating this is in an effort to avoid criticism blame failure judgment shame.
00:15:02
And it's not that people walk around feeling ashamed all the time I make that clear it's that we know what shame feels like if we are seen as imperfect if we are seen as not saying yes when someone expects us to if we are seen expressing our feelings and being called too much.
00:15:21
If we are seen just if we are seen at all can be its own thing we know what that feels like and the exposure of it and so that's where we try to engage in perfectionism people pleasing control because it's more certain like we can try to control how we are perceived by others that's the crux of it and what I just talked about for the last minute and a half is a lot.
00:15:48
That's its own is they long workshop it sure is but I do think that the shame really understanding what we're trying to avoid with these behaviors because here's the thing we make sense as human beings right what we do make sense and always would make me feel good when my therapist would say that I would be talking about some behavior that I was doing that I hated that I was feeling ashamed of I was feeling bad about and she was like well.
00:16:16
Did it make you feel better in the moment and I'm like yes and she's like see because your brain makes them yeah and so if you're saying you don't want to do that we can talk about that but it's it's not making it pathological right it's like okay you you're seeking relief but maybe that's not the right way to go about it.
00:16:36
I'm always asking my clients if they're willing to sort of slow down from running away from particular feelings and turn around and can we just look can we together I'll be with you let's let's look at what is it what is the fear and then it really can it just comes up when you ask when you ask the questions people just say sort of what it is and I see the thing with people pleasing perfectionism and this need for control.
00:17:05
How much that how much bandwidth that takes in our lives away from other endeavors that would probably be our time and bandwidth much better spent on these other endeavors you know.
00:17:22
Yeah and I think I want to say to and this is I think what you were pointing at they work for a little while I always kind of have joke that perfectionism and control got me to graduate with honors from college and they work so we keep relying on them and and there's a saying I take a lot away from the 12 steps of alcohol an autonomous and they say it works until it doesn't.
00:17:48
You know they're talking specifically about drinking booze I think it's the same with these behaviors that we employ they work until they don't and then they start to feel really terrible and then many times that's the point where we're like why do I not feel great about how I'm showing up in the world why are my relationships falling apart you know because a lot of this has to be co dependence as well and I also want to say even as far as I have come and I'm I don't know if you can relate but.
00:18:17
The decades that I've been doing this work not just doing it personally been teaching it professionally I still fall into some of those behaviors sometimes yep.
00:18:26
On the regular absolutely yeah I have comfortable friends.
00:18:32
Yes I have to say you know I always talk with high function and co dependency which is a lot of this stuff overlaps I always talk about we can get into recovery right but there's no cure.
00:18:45
For this experience it's like any other compulsive behavior and in the book in in too much I actually write a whole story about slipping back into like super co dependent behavior pattern with my mother that diagnosed with cancer over the pandemic like I was already you know if you're someone who's recovering control freak.
00:19:05
I'm a pandemic can really kick up those old feelings it's old desires yep and then my mother getting sick where you can't control it's like dangerous go to the hospital was just a whole thing was a book a nightmare but what it is.
00:19:19
It in in the book I talk about how that that's a relapse right so I relapsed into this old behavior of like controlling the crap trying to control my sister is telling everyone what to do making up.
00:19:32
Johnny is healing calendar with making it would sign up to call her you know just just over functioning doing anything yes but why to not feel.
00:19:44
How I scared I was about her mortality I didn't want her to die still though she's not dead she's left and she's fine thank God.
00:19:52
But you know that that I feel like these behaviors you just said you know you fall into them there's a reality that when you're empathic.
00:20:01
When you are feeling human being and for many of us many of the people in your crew and mine as well we identify is being highly sensitive where we identify is being a path.
00:20:13
In like a different way where you were really in our fields a lot of the time and so it takes a certain amount of energy you know in the book you talk about the whole this whole the whole mindset of like.
00:20:27
You know being being strong and sort of not giving a book about things right this give zero fucks right now what we used to say.
00:20:35
And that in the book you talk about it as potentially doing more harm than good for what it is we want to achieve in life so let's talk a little bit about that yes all or nothing mentality you know that it's black white and.
00:20:49
And this is also something new over the last few years that wasn't present with me when I first wrote the book is is the concept that multiple things can be true at once that seem counter intuitive the same opposing.
00:21:05
And and with with this particular case of giving zero fox I think that it's a nice sentiment you know it means well it's an expression that means well.
00:21:17
And in a culture where women are socially conditioned and brought up to care more so about other people's comfort and what they think more so than our own I think then it again it means well however.
00:21:31
It's the it's the it's the extremism of it that concerns me and also I do not love I call it the memification of personal growth you know we take these big concepts of you know not taking things personally or not you know carrying whether people the opinions of other other people and we.
00:21:51
Pass it down into several words to fit on a meme for Pinterest or Instagram and it misses so much nuance and then people walk away feeling worse about themselves because I can't do the thing that they read on the meme.
00:22:01
And this is one of those and I the my short answer is that it's a it's a learning how to care about the right amount of people's opinions your own being the most important and and one of the things one of my takeaways from my brain a brown training is it's called the square inch box.
00:22:19
And it's literally a square inch box which is pretty small and you write the names of the people that you care the most about their opinion and you think about why like is this someone that you have built a reciprocal trusting relationship with.
00:22:35
The question that I get a lot of times when I'm doing this exercise with people is they say do I have to put my mom on there.
00:22:42
Yeah you don't like they feel bad about it and so like these are the types of exercise I'm talking about is particularly when it comes to like whose opinion do we care about and it might depend on different parts of your life whether it's work or parenting or you know whatever but yeah that's just one of many.
00:23:00
It's also a lot of that it's a lot of memifications, miniaturizations that can chop my head.
00:23:15
Well I it chaps mine too and we're especially in respect to the mental health world because now it's become it's funny it's become popular trending.
00:23:24
There's a lot of myths misconception misuse of terms whether it's narcissism whether it's gaslighting whether it's love bombing whether it's trauma bonding whether it's codependence codependence where I'm like okay people still don't know what it is.
00:23:43
And you know so I saw something the other day that someone had written it and seen it before where they're like not everyone is an narcissist some people who just regular asshole or entitled yeah they're just entitled yeah especially men that grew up in this culture.
00:23:58
Yeah I mean not all but yes I mean there's a reality of that so let's talk about because I find this in my community difficulty in the book you talk about how people can break out of isolation.
00:24:12
It's sort of actually reach out for support because I think that at least in my community asking for help is very difficult.
00:24:22
I want to start by saying I think that many times the reason that asking for help is hard because we have to expose a part of ourselves that we feel sometimes ashamed of.
00:24:36
Very least we feel afraid of exposing it for fear of judgment criticism feeling like we're the only one is incredibly vulnerable to ask for help not just for the sake of accepting the help but for the sake of exposing our own vulnerabilities.
00:24:57
I want to start there because I think it's a it's a point that needs to not be stepped over and because it's not that it's not that easy it's not that simple to acknowledge and have compassion for yourself that you haven't done it yet.
00:25:14
Please be kind to yourself around that you're not alone and it's a valid fear it's a valid fear 100% that being said.
00:25:23
I think that it's you know I also don't tell people to do this willy nilly you know it needs to I love how Bernays says you know with someone who's earned the right to hear your story that's what she's talking about when she's when she's saying you know when we're saying like ask for help because you are having to tell someone in essence your story it may not be a traditional from a traditional sense of a story but you're telling someone the story of your heart your feelings in your experiences that's your story and it's from your heart.
00:25:52
So I just wanted to spend a moment on that and and it's just it really is about in this part takes effort and I'm sorry but it does especially as adults and and I you know for talking about men we have a loneliness of a sort of like you know they're the what is it like the subgroup that that takes their own life the most statistically yeah adult friendship is challenging.
00:26:18
I think especially post pandemic that we have become used to working from home.
00:26:24
Everything is on is like this this kind of transaction that we gather less I know that my teenagers their life and their friendships looks very different than it did when you and I were teenagers things have changed.
00:26:37
We were always out of the house always always gone always gone always at somebody else's we were always gathering in person.
00:26:44
Yes it doesn't happen as much anymore and so I think it's harder now than ever to create the type of friendship the type of relationship needed in order to ask for help.
00:26:55
And so I also want to say like when I'm talking about asking for help many times it's about not necessarily can you help me move on Saturday.
00:27:04
It's can you give me 15 minutes of your time because I'm falling apart.
00:27:10
And I need someone to sit with me during that as one of the most vulnerable things will ever do and so if you know if I had to kind of put a put a period at the end of the sentence.
00:27:20
It's it's taking the effort and the time to nurture your friendships like you would a romantic relationship.
00:27:28
So sometimes these are hard conversations like hey I know we've been friends at work for a little while and I would love to.
00:27:36
I would love to hang out with you more and get to know you better and I think you're cool and what would you think of that is vulnerable this is what I work with my clients.
00:27:46
Asking friends out in a date and holding them accountable around it and and also working with them when things don't when the other person doesn't respond as as they want them to or feeling like they're the only one doing all the heavy lifting in the relationship like friendship coaching is a thing.
00:28:04
Yep yeah it really is and I think that another part of this that we don't talk about a lot with friendships is that a lot of times we're playing unreasonable injuries out in friendship.
00:28:16
So if you're someone who had a very punitive mother but you didn't really figured out you may find yourself with super judgmental friends.
00:28:24
Who you feel like you're trying to please and you're walking on eggshells around then it's like hmm how is this should familiar to me right I'm repeating something which is why I always feel like really figuring out the original injuries like the big ones in our lives is so important because we're going to talk about or we're going to act about because they're not just going to go quietly into the night right they that's not how it is.
00:28:51
So if we're acting out in friendships we we need to go okay why don't I have better boundaries with this person what is this why am I tolerating this yes yes exactly and we can really make figure out why we are.
00:29:06
Really by just looking and going well this person reminds me so much of my punitive mother and suddenly I had a situation when I had a therapist years ago who I had something happening with Vic that I was sort of having an amplified response to.
00:29:20
And I realized wow this is I'm having a transference to my mother like it's it's not whatever whatever he's doing is reminding me of something I didn't like or something that was scary about my mother and my therapist would make me say as soon as I would get into that sort of panic spiral.
00:29:36
Vic is not mom and I feel like this could be helpful when we're talking about the friendship stuff if people are feeling like you know why am I you know relating this way because it almost is like a way to be empowered.
00:29:50
Because really when we're having a transference is almost like I would turn into the little kid and start relating to Vic that way rather than.
00:29:58
From the you know the grown up empowered Terry person that I actually make sense yeah I and if you know if I could kind of give anyone sort of a 4-1-1 if you will around this I think that any time sometimes it's hard to recognize those that in the moment.
00:30:15
I think that any time you have a little bit of a visceral reaction to something that you typically dismiss.
00:30:24
And that's the thing that I would just pay attention to don't you don't need to take any action on it right away but just start paying attention to your pattern in the friendship.
00:30:34
And it's not about making other person better wrong it's not about making you were better wrong just notice because I notice that in I if I look back on some of my friendships where I let things slide.
00:30:45
That was my pattern is that somebody would do something that would hurt my feelings even if it was just a little bit and I would think to myself well that's one of the big of a deal.
00:30:55
You know and just oh I'm I'm probably over reacting which coincidentally is what I heard growing up and then it would sort of slowly over years it would just like these little kind of pinholes would build up and build up.
00:31:07
And then the other person would do something kind of minor and it fly off the handle because I don't know the way the moon was in my period and everything and it was just like where did that come from.
00:31:17
Well some of those little pinholes that I didn't say anything so it's it yes and then we get into you know how to communicate in the moment when it happens which is another conversation but and you tension can be a huge tool to relax.
00:31:41
All right so tell people where can we get this book when is it dropping when did it dropped it or yeah December around Christmas time 2024 and I just I cannot get over this like grown up version of me and I'm like is that me.
00:31:46
I love it because on the original title I don't know if people can see it the original cover is a picture of me from like 2011 and it's just I'm older and wiser and just still your big sis.
00:31:57
And of December where ever books are sold yeah there's a bunch of free stuff per use.
00:32:03
Of course so where can people get the free so where should they go to buy the book.
00:32:08
Andrea Owen dot com slash books that's where all of mine are and you'll see.
00:32:12
Great at the top of the page 52 ways to live a kick ass life and they can just go from there.
00:32:17
Well thank you so much for spending time for having this beautiful conversation with us today I really appreciate you.
00:32:22
Thanks babe thanks everybody listen for listening.
00:32:29
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00:32:37
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00:32:42
Thank you thank you thank you for watching and or listening I hope you have an amazing week and as always take care of you.
00:32:51
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