Rory Sutherland is one of the world’s most fascinating thinkers in advertising and behavioral science. In this episode, he breaks down why logic often kills creativity, why the dumbest ideas (like Red Bull) end up making billions, and how consumer behavior makes no rational sense. From frozen yogurt lines to Airbnb’s unintended consequences, this conversation dives into the messy, illogical, and deeply human side of decision-making. We also had a whole lot of fun. Rory is one entertaining guy.

Key Discussion Points

• Why logical decisions rarely lead to innovation


• Red Bull, frozen yogurt, and the psychology of “dumb” ideas


• Why entrepreneurs belong in casinos, not chess clubs


• How framing and emotion drive behavior more than facts


• Airbnb, matcha, and the paradox of things that shouldn’t work but do

ANDDDD Much, much more

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Chapters:

0:00 Rory on Australia & first impressions

6:15 Ice cream vs frozen yogurt psychology

12:42 Restaurants, failure & Darwinian innovation

18:55 Why luck beats logic in business

25:30 The Red Bull paradox

31:48 Bubble tea, matcha & strange consumer habits

38:22 Why Australians undervalue themselves

45:10 Breakthroughs born by accident

52:04 The danger of pure logic

58:40 Emotion > facts in persuasion

1:05:15 Electric cars & tribal identity

1:12:02 Pensions, dating apps & real priorities

1:18:47 Social constraints we never question

1:25:33 Airbnb’s unintended consequences

1:32:20 Experience goods: only valuable once tried

1:39:05 Why Americans adopt faster

1:45:55 The myth of perfect information

1:52:40 Airports, bad purchases & brain mush

1:59:00 Final reflections with Rory

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