Martin Gutmann is an expert on the history of business and has written extensively about styles of past leaders.  In this episode, he shares his thoughts on everything from today’s political climate, to whether he thinks Ernest Shackleton is overrated (spoiler alert – he does), to the underrated excellence of less well-known figures in history. 

 Chapters:

02:27 Meet Martin Gutmann 
Bill welcomes Martin Gutmann to the podcast, exploring his diverse background and extensive experience in various countries. Martin shares how his journey has shaped his understanding of different cultures and leadership. 

04:24 The Role of History in Leadership 
Martin discusses how historical insights can inform contemporary challenges, particularly in leadership and management. He emphasizes the necessity of understanding history to navigate present issues effectively. 

07:06 Lessons from the Past 
The conversation shifts to how past solutions have created today’s problems, with Martin referencing the Industrial Revolution and its consequences. He highlights the importance of learning from history to find modern solutions. 

10:11 The Optimism of Youth 
Bill and Martin reflect on the idealism of younger generations regarding climate change and sustainability. They discuss how engaging with young people can inspire hope for the future. 

14:02 The Qualities of Great Leaders 
Martin shares insights on the characteristics of effective leaders, emphasizing their ability to envision possibilities that others cannot see. He contrasts this with the qualities of less favorable leaders. 

16:11 Reevaluating Historical Figures 
The discussion turns to notable historical figures, with Martin expressing a preference for lesser-known leaders who have made significant impacts. He critiques the common narratives surrounding famous leaders like Thomas Jefferson. 

20:04 Unseen Leaders and Their Impact 
Martin elaborates on the contributions of unseen leaders, using the example of Vasily Archipov during the Cuban Missile Crisis. He illustrates how individual actions can alter the course of history. 

27:01 Churchill: The Crisis Manager 
Explore Winston Churchill’s complex legacy as a leader during World War II, where he was thrust into a crisis not of his making. This chapter delves into the nuances of his leadership style, contrasting crisis management with the ability to foresee and avoid crises. 

35:12 The Unseen Leader: Shackleton vs. Amundsen 
Martin Gutmann discusses the concept of the ‘unseen leader’ through the lens of explorers Shackleton and Amundsen. While Shackleton’s dramatic story captivates audiences, Amundsen’s meticulous planning and authentic leadership provide deeper lessons in effective leadership. 

42:55 The Challenge of Leadership in Media 
In this chapter, the conversation shifts to the media’s portrayal of leadership, emphasizing how crises and scandals often overshadow the quiet, effective leaders. Martin and Bill reflect on the disparity between public admiration for dramatic leaders versus those who exemplify humility and competence.