This week’s guest is the musician, actor, writer, and podcaster Jordan Stephens.

Jordan’s probably best known for Rizzle Kicks, the chart-topping duo he formed with his friend Harley Alexander-Sule, back in 2008.

He's since released music as a solo artist, starred in various TV and film projects, published a children’s book, and now he’s written a memoir: Avoidance, Drugs, Heartbreak and Dogs.

In this conversation the pair discuss education, the impact of overnight success, ADHD, medication and self-medication, as well as their shared interest in psychedelics and Jordan’s journey towards healthier relationships.

For more information on some of the subjects Jordan mentioned, there are links below (including more on Professor Nutt and that toad venom).

And Jordan WILL return to On The Mend. These two just have too much in common.

Related links:

Jordan’s website

Rizzle Kicks on Instagram

Matt’s interview with Jordan on MTV Faces

BRIT School bursaries

Alan Watts on education

Dr Gabor Maté

The Anxious Generation by Joanthan Haidt

Johann Hari’s episode of On The Mend

Professor David Nutt and drug classification

A 2002 overview of the link between football hooliganism and ecstasy

The effects of the inhalation of dried toad secretion containing 5-MeO-DMT

The ongoing study at King’s College, London

The Esther Perel quote was incorrectly attributed but she’s a fan of the person who said it, Terry Real: “Under patriarchy, you can be connected, or you can be powerful, but you can't be both at the same time because power is power over, not power with, it’s dominance. So, if you move into power, you lose connection. If you move into accommodation, you lose your power. I want to break that binary.”

Donna Lancaster & The Bridge Retreat

(01:02 ) Jordan’s childhood

(05:28 ) BRIT School and creative education

(11:48 ) Rizzle Kicks, Busted and dealing with overnight success

(16:36 ) ADHD: from voice notes to diagnoses (plural)

(20:34 ) ADHD: medication and self-medication 

(27:40 ) Pattern recognition and relationships

(29:07 ) Sobriety and overcoming writer’s block

(30:54 ) Managing social media use

(35:52 ) Psychedelics (including dried toad secretion)

(45:43 ) Pressure to achieve vs connection

(47:02 ) Educating the next generation about relationships

(54:15 ) Matt’s conclusion