The Swimming Abilities of Dead Trout - DTNS 4921
Update: 2024-12-23
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Dr. Niki reveals the big 2024 winners of this year’s Ig Nobel Prizes and why you shouldn’t take it too seriously. Plus the Exoskeleton Laboratory team at the KAIST in Daejeon have developed a lightweight wearable exoskeleton that helps a paraplegic patient walk. And Meta might be adding a display to their Ray-Ban smart glasses next year.
Starring Tom Merritt, Dr. Niki Ackermans, Roger Chang, Joe.
Link to the Show Notes.
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Transcript
00:00:00
Daily Techno Show is made possible by you, the listener.
00:00:03
Thank you, Brad, Kevin Morgan, Paul Teason, and brand new patron, Steven Daniel.
00:00:10
Welcome, Steve.
00:00:11
Welcome, Daniel.
00:00:12
On this episode of DTNS, smart glasses are already the product of the year for next year.
00:00:17
An exoskeleton to help people climb stairs.
00:00:20
And Dr.
00:00:20
Nikki reviews the winners of the ignoble prizes for weirdest science that makes you laugh and think.
00:00:27
And laugh, think.
00:00:28
What points?
00:00:31
This is the Daily Techno's for Monday, December 23, 2024 in Los Angeles.
00:00:35
I'm Tom Merritt.
00:00:37
From Goat Central, Alabama, I'm Dr.
00:00:39
Nikki Ackerman's.
00:00:40
And I'm the shows producer, Roger Chang.
00:00:43
How are the goats in Central, Alabama?
00:00:45
They're still dead.
00:00:46
So it's going well.
00:00:48
Oh, I mean, if they were, did they came back to life?
00:00:51
Oh, yeah, I was going to say, I want to say I'm sorry to hear that, but that's kind of the point, right?
00:00:55
Yeah.
00:00:56
You don't want to study the live ones.
00:00:57
It's too hard to get a look at their skull.
00:00:59
Yeah.
00:01:01
They're always moving.
00:01:03
More on that later, let's start with the quick hits.
00:01:07
Bloomberg reports, Apple's working on a smart lock in the doorbell that would use Face ID.
00:01:12
The system might work with a bunch of multiple third party locks, or they might just partner with one.
00:01:18
We don't know yet.
00:01:19
But it could be released by the end of next year at the earliest.
00:01:23
See, to be abased and noted on our subreddit, the telegram says it's profitable.
00:01:27
Pauvel Dorov, the founder of telegram, said Monday they have 12 million paid users, and they're considering going public.
00:01:34
RWN Ash posted this on the subreddit analyst Ming Qi Quo says Apple is going to use TSMC's advanced N3P node for its M5 chips.
00:01:43
And what's interesting about that is the CPU and the GPU on the N3P node built chips have separate designs.
00:01:52
So it's more of a server-like arrangement that improves production yields and thermal performance and can run at full power longer before needing to be throttled down to prevent overheating.
00:02:01
Quo says Apple might use the M5 Pro chips to power Apple intelligence servers.
00:02:07
Jury and a federal case in Delaware found Friday that Qualcomm did not breach its agreements with ARM as a result of its acquisition of Nuvia in 2021.
00:02:16
Qualcomm just kept paying its own rate after it acquired Nuvia rather than the higher Nuvia rate.
00:02:20
And ARM didn't like that.
00:02:22
However, the jury did not determine if Nuvia breached its agreement, meaning that this case might be brought again.
00:02:29
And if Qualcomm and ARM don't settle, it will be brought again.
00:02:32
Finally, Palantir and Anderl are teaming up to convince other tech companies to join them to create a consortium to bid on defense contracts.
00:02:41
You know, if they all pool together, they have a better chance of getting the contracts.
00:02:44
Financial time says that they've been talking to SpaceX, open AI, Seronic and scale AI among others.
00:02:51
And if you need a reminder, Palantir was founded by Peter Teal, former PayPal exec, and Anderl was founded and is currently run by Oculus founder Palmer Lucky.
00:03:00
The financial time sources say meta plans to introduce a display to its RayBand smart glasses, quote,
00:03:10
as soon as next year.
00:03:12
The display would be used to show you notifications and responses from the virtual assistant.
00:03:16
So right now you can talk to it and it'll talk back.
00:03:19
With this one, it could just show you something.
00:03:21
Meta showed off an advanced display called Orion back in September, but that prototype is still considered too expensive to bring to market.
00:03:28
So this more limited version would be the way that Meta could bring some displays into its headgear.
00:03:36
Google and Samsung are also working to make a device using Android XR that would work in a similar way.
00:03:41
So it looks like more displays coming to smart glasses in 2025.
00:03:45
On threads, Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg said glasses will be the next major computing platform.
00:03:53
We've already talked a lot about on DTNS, like, do you want to wear your computer on your face?
00:03:58
But Nikki, we haven't asked you.
00:03:59
Would you like to wear your computer on your face?
00:04:01
So I have notifications disabled on my smartwatch.
00:04:04
So I probably wouldn't get an extra device to put them on my face.
00:04:08
I'm too distractable.
00:04:10
But as usual, I recognize the benefits to that.
00:04:13
And I will say, I don't know if maybe I'm not old enough, but this is the first wearable on your head thing that I've seen out in the wild.
00:04:20
I was at a conference recently.
00:04:21
And I saw someone using these as their everyday glasses.
00:04:24
So maybe they're actually one of these that's actually going to work.
00:04:28
Or I mean, I guess they are working since we're getting a 2.0 soon.
00:04:31
I have the first version of them.
00:04:33
They do look like normal glasses.
00:04:36
The second version look even more like normal glasses than the first version.
00:04:39
They're even not quite as thick as the first version.
00:04:43
I assume that the third version is going to get even more glasses looking.
00:04:48
I think one of the reasons people like them, and they really like the version too, is quite a bit, is that they are unobtrusive, right?
00:04:56
You can talk to it when you want to.
00:04:58
You can press the button to film when you want to.
00:05:00
But otherwise, they're just glasses.
00:05:03
And I wonder if notifications is something no one really wants.
00:05:08
Whereas lots of people leave notifications on on their phone, I'm like you.
00:05:11
I turn notifications off in as many places as possible.
00:05:14
I have as few of them as possible.
00:05:16
But not everybody's like that.
00:05:18
And if you were to have notifications constantly flipping up in your view, I imagine that would be a detraction.
00:05:24
It would be a-- Yeah.
00:05:25
I also note that being on the other side of those and looking at someone where you can see the little camera feels weird.
00:05:32
It's like, am I always being filmed?
00:05:34
I don't know.
00:05:35
I didn't really like that.
00:05:36
But I guess you could just ignore it eventually.
00:05:38
They do have a light that comes on.
00:05:40
They have worked to try to make the light more visible so that you know when someone's taking a photo or taking a video.
00:05:45
But yeah, that is a concern for these.
00:05:49
I do think that while it's fun to poke fun at Meta and be like, oh, you're not doing a Metaverse, you're doing glasses.
00:05:56
Glasses are the next major computing platform.
00:05:59
I think this is a step down the road to something that would one day be the Metaverse, right?
00:06:03
If they could put VR Metaverse into them, they would.
00:06:07
I'm sure they're eventually going to work on that.
00:06:09
Yeah, and the way you get there is step by step.
00:06:11
So having any kind of display in the glasses, whether it's for notifications or whether it's for something else, I think is useful.
00:06:20
I think I would be curious if it's capable of doing more than just showing you a message.
00:06:25
So let's assume you turn notifications off.
00:06:27
You're left with, it could show you the answer to your question instead of reading it to you.
00:06:33
And maybe you prefer that.
00:06:35
That doesn't seem like a killer feature to me.
00:06:37
But okay, can it show me arrows when I'm doing navigation?
00:06:41
That's what I want.
00:06:42
Yeah, navigation or like subtitles on a movie.
00:06:46
Live translation would be another application for this.
00:06:50
If I'm sure this is a baby step towards integrating other things into the little visualization that you have on your head, could be cool.
00:07:00
Is it selling to people who don't normally use glasses?
00:07:04
I don't know.
00:07:05
I, well, it's definitely selling better than a lot of people expect it.
00:07:10
And by that respect, it is selling well.
00:07:14
I don't know how many people who don't need glasses are buying them.
00:07:17
You can put just clear glass in them and wear them that way.
00:07:21
But they are.
00:07:22
Some glasses, right?
00:07:23
Yeah, and you can get them as sunglasses.
00:07:24
So a lot of people would want them that way.
00:07:27
But you know, you're not always going to have sunglasses on.
00:07:31
I mean, sure, they're the quarry hearts of the world who wear their sunglasses at night, but, but most of us don't.
00:07:37
So, you know, that does limit their usage.
00:07:40
I, I do think that Zuckerberg's probably not far off that by the end of next year, when you go into the optometrist, not in all cases,
00:07:51
but in a lot of cases, they'll be like, you know, here are the basic frames, here are the ones with polarization and anti-glair and here are the smart, smart ones.
00:08:00
They'll have a section.
00:08:01
Of course.
00:08:02
And it looks like Androids working on this too and, and Samsung.
00:08:05
So let's, let's get at it.
00:08:07
Let's see what the competitors are bringing in.
00:08:09
And, and yeah, maybe for your yearly predictions, you should have thrown glasses in there.
00:08:12
You know, I did that.
00:08:13
I did predict that on the top five.
00:08:18
But, but Nikki is looking into the future to our predictions episode at the end of this month.
00:08:23
And it sounds like I won't do that from the predictions.
00:08:27
Interesting.
00:08:28
Yeah.
00:08:29
Just a hunch.
00:08:30
Even though you're telling me, and there's time for me to change my prediction, by the time the show comes out, I probably will have forgotten.
00:08:38
But yeah, I don't, I don't think I ended up doing that in our predictions episode, but, but I probably should.
00:08:45
And I will be looking for these sorts of things at CES with an eye toward like what's differentiating them?
00:08:55
Last year, there were a lot of companies doing them.
00:08:57
And so it was fun to be like, oh, there's this company.
00:08:59
X-Reel, they've got very compelling glasses that are competitive.
00:09:03
Meta of course gets the marketing boost because it's meta.
00:09:06
And they also, you know, have that have to partner with somebody like Luxotica that makes the Rayban brands.
00:09:12
I'll be interested to see if X-Reel or any of the other smaller makers are pushing the envelope on features.
00:09:18
You know, if they, if they're putting displays in these, what are their displays do?
00:09:21
What else are they, they're going to have these things do?
00:09:23
Because I do, I do think this is an area for a fertile ground we, if to put, you can get creative with this, especially if you got teams competing against each other.
00:09:32
So I say, go ahead.
00:09:34
Someone mentioned wearing sunglasses at night.
00:09:36
Let's throw night vision in there while we're at it.
00:09:39
Oh, yeah.
00:09:40
I mean, that's, that's another couple of steps down the road from notifications showing up in the corner.
00:09:45
But yeah, it is, it is interesting to see that this is now reaching parity with Google Glass.
00:09:53
Google Glass had no glass in it.
00:09:55
It just had the little display thing that would put an annoying green display in front of your eyes, but we're finally back to parity with Google Glass.
00:10:03
Yeah.
00:10:05
We were just a bit ahead of the times.
00:10:07
This next story is actually putting us into Ironman's universe, the exoskeleton laboratory team at the Korea Advanced Institute of Science and Technology,
00:10:18
or KAIST in Daejeon, has developed a lightweight wearable exoskeleton that helped a paraplegic patient walk, including climbing a staircase and avoiding obstacles,
00:10:30
particularly able to slide in between a narrow space between two benches and sit down.
00:10:36
paraplegic Kim Sung-han, who demonstrated the device, is also part of the KAIST team that developed it.
00:10:44
The exoskeleton can actually walk on its own so it can come to the patient and then help them put it on.
00:10:51
It kind of clamps down on them, and then they, that helps them stand up.
00:10:56
And then they latch it in.
00:10:58
It's called the walk-on suit F1, made of titanium and aluminum, weighs about 50 kilograms, so that's 110 pounds.
00:11:05
Sensors on the sides and upper body monitor signals at 1,000 times per second to anticipate intended movements.
00:11:12
We were looking really hard to figure out exactly how it does it.
00:11:15
All we could find is that it somehow uses the balance, so it may just be reading the balance of the person operating it.
00:11:24
It also has some lenses on the front to help it identify objects and stairs, so it can shift into stair climbing mode when necessary, but certainly not the first exoskeleton ever,
00:11:36
but able to do some interesting things that exoskeletons aren't always able to do.
00:11:40
- Yeah, I thought this one was interesting.
00:11:43
It seems like we have a very futuristic detanest today.
00:11:45
- Yeah, right.
00:11:47
- And the fact that this was developed as part of this kind of exoskeleton Olympiad where they developed the specific challenges, like you said, scooting in between a bench to test these machines,
00:11:57
it's pretty neat.
00:11:59
I love when the target population for something like this, which is in all essence like a disability aid or a movement aid, that population is actually included in developing the tool.
00:12:11
I think that usually tends to make the tool a lot better, so that's really exciting to see.
00:12:15
And yeah, an interesting aspect about how it responds to the person's balance with sensors on the inside and sensors on the outside to help them kind of move forward and do all these different movements.
00:12:27
I think it looks like the man that was in that video also had somewhat of a controller.
00:12:32
We're not quite sure.
00:12:33
- Yeah, there was some remote on the side, and we don't know how much that is involved in operating it, whether it's just pushing it forward or whether it can guide it a little bit,
00:12:45
but it definitely has all those sensors to maintain its balance.
00:12:49
And that is the other thing in the video, you see them using one of the canes to try to knock the thing over before he puts it on to show.
00:12:57
It can maintain its own balance really well.
00:13:00
- Yeah, and another innovation of this was that it comes over and hitches on to the front of the person, apparently a lot of the other exoskeletons kind of work from the back.
00:13:08
And that I can imagine is really helpful with balance because you can put your weight on it and move forward and kind of just let it support you in that way.
00:13:17
I don't know how that works with comfort, but it's interesting to see a different perspective on that.
00:13:22
- Yeah, I did not see anything about how comfortable this is or how long you would want to be in one of these.
00:13:28
This is very much about the technology for balance and precision.
00:13:33
So, you know, a lot of exoskeletons can't climb stairs.
00:13:36
This isn't the first one, but there aren't as many that are capable of that.
00:13:41
And I think one of the things they were touting is probably doesn't sound as impressive as it is.
00:13:45
You know, the ability to move to the side, to be able to move to the side without falling over, you know, and then be able to sit down on a bench in practice.
00:13:55
You know, think of how many kinds of seats, theater seats, subway seats, you know, things where you need to be able to do that.
00:14:01
You need to slide into a small space.
00:14:04
- I mean, even in the human body, that's a lot of micro movements and coordinated muscles and sensory feedback that's involved in those kinds of things that you don't think about when you do them, but once you can't do them,
00:14:15
it becomes really, really complicated.
00:14:16
So I'm assuming a lot of engineering is involved in just being able to do that.
00:14:20
And I think they said that they have some kind of integration with AI for detecting objects.
00:14:26
I'm sure that comes into this kind of, like you said, different seat height detection.
00:14:31
So yeah, cool innovation here from KAIST.
00:14:36
- Yeah, go day, John.
00:14:38
Good stuff.
00:14:39
If anybody knows anymore about this, by all means, feedback at dailytechnewshow.com.
00:14:44
In fact, if you have feedback about anything that gets brought up on the show, you can email us or get in touch with the folks on the socials.
00:14:53
@DTNSShow is our handle on X, on Instagram, on threads, on blue sky, and on mastodon.
00:15:01
DTNS Show.
00:15:02
I know there's two S's at it, but that's just the way it works.
00:15:04
DTNS Show.
00:15:06
- We voted.
00:15:07
- Yeah, on all of those platforms we did.
00:15:10
And the mastodon instance, if you need that directly, is mstdn.social.
00:15:15
If you'd like some video from us, you can find us on TikTok and on YouTube at dailytechnewsShow.
00:15:22
Now, probably everybody in the audience knows about the Nobel Prize, the awards given individuals who work for the benefit and advancement of humankind,
00:15:33
but maybe fewer of you know about the Ig Nobel Prize.
00:15:38
10 awards given to unusual scientific research, Dr.
00:15:42
Nikki, you thought it was a good time at the end of the year, since we already talked about the Nobel Prize, to look back on the Ig Nobel prizes.
00:15:49
First of all, tell us what those are.
00:15:51
- Yeah, so these were awarded back in September.
00:15:55
They're, you know, I don't think, considering the Nobel Prize episode we did, I don't think I'm in the running for a Nobel Prize, but I think I might be able to one day get an Ig Nobel Prize, someone just has to nominate me.
00:16:05
- Yeah.
00:16:06
- Basically, it's kind of a pun about the Nobel Prize, although the Nobel Prize is somewhat involved.
00:16:12
It is an honor that, so you get an award, the goal is that first the science makes people laugh and then actually think.
00:16:20
That's kind of the main theme.
00:16:23
They're all a little bit silly.
00:16:24
- So the science has to be legitimate.
00:16:24
- So the science has to be legitimate.
00:16:25
These are not like-- - The science is legitimate.
00:16:27
- Yeah.
00:16:28
- These are real publications, and it basically someone, either they're self-nominated or someone sees this and is like, wow, that's really, you know, they found something out, but it is kind of silly on the face of it, and so they get nominated.
00:16:39
I think there are 10,000 nominations this year.
00:16:41
- All right, let's run through some of your favorites.
00:16:45
The theme of the 2024 ceremony was Murphy's Law if anything can go wrong, it will.
00:16:51
So that's the table quite well.
00:16:53
Who won for the physics prize?
00:16:56
- Yeah, so I put this one first 'cause it's my favorite, James Leo of Harvard, one for demonstrating and explaining the swimming abilities of dead trout.
00:17:06
- Of dead trout.
00:17:07
- Yeah.
00:17:08
- Okay.
00:17:09
- So this one is great.
00:17:10
Basically, Leo was able to show that live fish don't actually need to move their muscles very much.
00:17:16
So by putting dead fish in specific stream conditions and using a system that measures muscle response to simulation called ectomyography.
00:17:27
Ectomyography, sorry.
00:17:29
Basically, it's the wake of the stream where these trout swim up that proposes their body because it's a specific foil shape.
00:17:36
You actually don't almost need to produce any energy, you just reuse the energy of the current.
00:17:42
So by using dead fish and making them able to do this, it shows that live fish aren't actually don't really need that much energy to do it.
00:17:49
- So wait, he was able to have the dead fish swim upstream?
00:17:53
- Yeah, so in like an artificial tank, but basically they created movement, that dead fish didn't move, but because of the turbulence in the tank, it propulse them.
00:18:04
- Okay, all right.
00:18:05
- Because of the specific shape of their body, kind of like how you see a canoe like stuck in the rapids, but it doesn't, it moves like you originally.
00:18:12
- The water's rushing past it, but it's not going anywhere, yeah.
00:18:14
- There you go.
00:18:15
- Okay.
00:18:16
- Something like that.
00:18:16
I'm not a physicist, but that's about it.
00:18:18
And this is really like silly and funny findings.
00:18:21
You kind of see the theme of how these prizes go, but now we understand better about hydrodynamics and how you can make things move efficiently in specific water system.
00:18:32
So pretty cool.
00:18:34
All right, let's move on to the Ig Nobel, of a send Nobel Prize for chemistry.
00:18:39
- Yes, so this was a team of researchers from the University of Amsterdam, and they developed a technique to tell apart drunk worms from sober worms.
00:18:50
- Hold on.
00:18:51
- Why?
00:18:53
- How does a worm get drunk?
00:18:54
How do you know?
00:18:55
- Oh, you just put it in alcohol.
00:18:57
- Well, okay.
00:18:58
- Ethanol.
00:18:58
- Won't that preserve it?
00:19:00
- Well, I'm sure there's some kind of dilution involved, but do they have little breathalyzers for the worms?
00:19:06
- Really to, yeah, this is a worm breathalyzer.
00:19:09
What was it really to get the worms drunk as much as, since it's really you have to put yourself in the mind of a chemist.
00:19:16
- Okay.
00:19:16
- They're interested in how different sized polymers are transported based on their size.
00:19:23
- Okay.
00:19:24
- This is done, the technique is called chromatography.
00:19:27
And they just figured out, well, some polymers are actually active on their own.
00:19:32
So what would be a good model for something that's active on its own, a worm.
00:19:36
And a worm is basically to a chemist, a giant polymer.
00:19:39
So if you have to, you want to figure out if the activity of the worm is messing with how it can be transported in a medium.
00:19:48
And how do you mess with the activity of a locomotion you make something drunk?
00:19:52
This is their spot process.
00:19:54
So what they did is in a chromatograph, you have basically a geometric array.
00:20:00
It's on a microscopic scale, a bunch of little poles kind of like a maze.
00:20:04
And they let these worms pass through this array and some of the worms they intoxicated.
00:20:10
They gave them a bit of ethanol just so that they would maybe have a slower activity rate.
00:20:14
And then they made the worms race each other.
00:20:16
So they race the drunk worms against the sober worms and surprise, they found that the level of activity of the worms does determine how they're sorted as a polymer in chromatography.
00:20:29
So less activity, you're sorted differently than more activity.
00:20:32
And then they can translate this to other instances, maybe not worms but active polymers.
00:20:39
- So this was not, let's get half the worms drunk and see who wins the race.
00:20:44
This was, this was, let's see how they sort out at the end or is it, yeah.
00:20:51
- Yeah, well the non-drunk worms did win.
00:20:54
- Yeah, I would guess they would.
00:20:56
- Which is what you would expect, but yeah, it's kind of how they sort out, like is moving erratically or moving slower affecting the way that sorting happens in the chromatic room.
00:21:05
- Okay, all right, I'm not sure I 100% understand but I sort of, let's get it.
00:21:10
And of course, like everyone else, I'm imagining a little like free, free worm beer bar for half the worms.
00:21:18
- They also dyed the worms blue and red for like each team so that they could tell them a part.
00:21:22
- So they could tell them a part, interesting.
00:21:24
But now they wouldn't have to.
00:21:25
Now they could look at the sorting and know without having to dye them, which is kind of the idea.
00:21:30
All right, let's go for the Ig Nobel Prize for Medicine.
00:21:34
- This one's great and I'm really glad I wasn't a participant in this experiment, but a team from the University of Hamburg and Germany did a test on 77 participants to demonstrate that fake medicine has painful side,
00:21:47
sorry, fake medicine with painful side effects is more effective than fake medicine without painful side effects.
00:21:53
- So wait, the medicines fake, but it can't do something to you.
00:21:57
And in some cases, it hurts.
00:22:00
- So it's basically an expansion on the placebo effect.
00:22:03
Let me explain.
00:22:06
- Okay.
00:22:06
- So placebo effect being that you take something that you're told it's a medicine and so you believe you are feeling better and then you actually do feel better.
00:22:14
- Right, right.
00:22:15
- And so in this case, they had participants spray what they called a pain medicine into their nose.
00:22:22
Although it was a placebo, it was just saline.
00:22:24
And one group actually had this spray with capsaicin in it.
00:22:28
So like the thing that makes hot sauce spicy they sprayed up their nose.
00:22:33
- How?
00:22:34
- Yeah, that's horrible.
00:22:35
- And then both groups, they put into a functional MRI so that they could see activities in the brain related to pain and they gave them a thermal stimulus.
00:22:44
So probably just a little hot kind of not a burn but something that you can do legally.
00:22:50
And the group showed a lower pain response in response to this stimulus was the spicy nose spray group.
00:22:57
- Hold on.
00:23:00
- Hold on, hold on.
00:23:01
- And I don't want to be the kind of person that says, well, I know better than these scientists 'cause I'm sure they thought of this.
00:23:09
But what if the capsaicin is causing the pain reduction?
00:23:13
- We know a lot about the, I'm assuming, but we know a lot about the things about capsaicin.
00:23:21
It's been used as like a neuroscience testing thing for how we know that it doesn't.
00:23:25
The point is that it causes pain.
00:23:27
- So we know that capsaicin doesn't have a side effect when the shot up the nose of reducing pain in your arm.
00:23:34
It's very basic.
00:23:35
- And it's very possible that they had an extra control group that didn't have the stimulus that had capsaicin.
00:23:39
- But had the capsaicin.
00:23:40
Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no good.
00:23:42
- I didn't have the entire paper.
00:23:43
- That's why I said, I don't want to say this can't be true because I'm like, I have this question I bet they addressed.
00:23:48
So that's good.
00:23:49
- It is important to test for controls and you're very smart to point that out.
00:23:53
- Yeah.
00:23:53
- Well thanks.
00:23:54
- The point for the scientist here is that when you feel the side effect, so you're like this medicine heals you, but it stays a little bit when you put in your nose.
00:24:03
Then you know that the medicine is working.
00:24:05
And so in your mind, you're like, okay, well, I don't feel pain because the medicine worked.
00:24:09
- So we need tingly placebos as well.
00:24:12
- Well, this goes along with other things we know about the placebo effect, which is if the pill that you have it's placebo is bigger, you believe that it works better.
00:24:20
And if it's more expensive, you believe that it works better.
00:24:23
And so it turns out, if it's more painful, you also believe that it works better.
00:24:26
So this is a fun one.
00:24:27
- I mean, placebos, they work, right?
00:24:29
- Yeah.
00:24:30
- Yeah.
00:24:30
- All right, real quickly before we wrap up the demography prize, who won that one?
00:24:36
- Yeah, so this goes to Sol just in Newman from Oxford.
00:24:40
And I don't know, Tom, if you've heard about blue zones.
00:24:44
- Yes, I have, but this is recently been a documentary on Netflix, zones where people live to 100 and older and people are very mystified about how, what are they doing?
00:24:54
Are they eating a lot of fish and what's going on?
00:24:55
Well, Dr.
00:24:57
Newman found out for his detective work, he got this prize.
00:25:01
He discovered that many of the people from these blue zones having lived the longest life, lived in paces with lousy, birth, and death record keeping.
00:25:08
Essentially, the places that are reported to do this generally suffer from either just not issuing birth certificates,
00:25:18
lots of clerical errors or people who do a lot of pension fraud.
00:25:22
So, probably that's just not true at all.
00:25:25
- So they weren't necessarily living longer.
00:25:29
They just said they were old.
00:25:30
And we didn't have any way of telling.
00:25:33
- How do you live to 100?
00:25:34
You count bad.
00:25:35
- And so they were able to determine this by looking at people with solid verifiable records and seeing, oh, there wasn't much difference, I guess, is what I mean.
00:25:45
- I think they checked like the rate of clerical errors, the rate of pension fraud and whether or not the country issued birth certificates, so you could definitely check pages like this.
00:25:55
I can imagine you can't necessarily check the whole country if those records aren't there.
00:25:59
- The point being record keeping is really important in science and in everybody.
00:26:03
- Turns out diet may be better for your longevity than blue zone, just moving to a blue zone.
00:26:11
- And keeping records.
00:26:13
- And keeping records is going to help all the two.
00:26:15
- All right, let's check out the mail bag.
00:26:19
First of all, we got Cindy writing regarding our discussion on GDI Friday about YouTube guilty pleasures.
00:26:26
Cindy says mine is girl with the dogs.
00:26:30
She does dog and cat grooming videos.
00:26:32
She actually has two channels.
00:26:34
The videos on girl with the dogs are shorter than the ones on girl with the dogs too.
00:26:38
And Bert said I use YouTube for repairs.
00:26:41
I repaired my dishwasher with a YouTube video.
00:26:44
Hopefully you mean you looked at the YouTube video and then repaired it, not putting the YouTube video in the dishwasher.
00:26:49
Do you have a YouTube guilty pleasure, Dr.
00:26:52
Nikki?
00:26:52
- I do, I have two.
00:26:54
So one of them is Simone Yetch's channel which used to be all about shitty robots and now it's just about making really awesome stuff.
00:27:00
I love Simone and she's just awesome.
00:27:04
I don't know, I'll watch anything that comes out of her channel.
00:27:06
- Yeah, that's hardly a other one.
00:27:08
- That's a good one.
00:27:09
- I should have looked up the name.
00:27:10
Maybe if I talk long enough, I can pull it up.
00:27:12
But it is a fashion from the old times channel.
00:27:17
People recreate Victorian era dresses.
00:27:21
And it's one of those things, I'll never do that.
00:27:23
But I'd like to watch someone do that for like three hours.
00:27:28
- Yep.
00:27:29
- I couldn't tell you the name, which is terrible.
00:27:31
But maybe what's yours, Tom?
00:27:33
And then I can pull up the name.
00:27:34
- I, let's see, well, I don't really have an answer on Friday and now I don't remember what it was like.
00:27:42
Do you just not have time to watch it, Randall?
00:27:46
- No, no, I watch a lot of YouTube stuff.
00:27:49
I mean, I'm trying to think what would count as a guilty pleasure.
00:27:53
We watch a Cecilia Bloomdahl's channel about living in Longerban, which is north of the Arctic Circle in Svalbard.
00:28:04
But that's not really a guilty pleasure.
00:28:06
- Oh yeah, I know that one.
00:28:07
- I have watched those like, here's how a restaurant prepares to make a thousand meals during the day where they're like, you know, mixing a hundred eggs.
00:28:17
Roger watches those too.
00:28:19
Those are always fun.
00:28:20
- Those are pretty great.
00:28:21
I can't find these.
00:28:22
- I do, in fact, watch those because they have a very narcotic effect on me and I fall asleep.
00:28:27
- They are, yeah, they do make you sleepy.
00:28:30
Oh, I found her.
00:28:31
Carolina, Zibrowska.
00:28:33
- There you go, had to plug.
00:28:34
- Thanks.
00:28:36
- Allison Sheridan, after our Thursday discussion I went looking for a hundred debuts and found not a hundred debuts, but William, Hunter Debuts, who lived between 1899 and 1987.
00:28:48
He was married to Mary Custis Lee in 1925.
00:28:53
Woodrow Wilson's presidency was till 1921, so the timing is off, but that didn't stop Allison from digging.
00:29:00
Mary Custis Lee isn't Mary Anna Randolph Custis Lee, but she was married to Robert E.
00:29:07
Lee, which was wildly interesting.
00:29:09
Allison says, "I spent some quality time pursuing "relatives of Woodrow Wilson's two wives, "Ellen Louise Axon Wilson, who died during his presidency "and Edith Bowling-Galt Wilson, "who became the first next first lady,
00:29:21
"but didn't get anywhere there either.
00:29:23
"But hey, I found William Hunter debuts, "so maybe he's not entirely imaginary.
00:29:29
"Also, fun fact, there was a junior and a second "and on until William Hunter debuts the fourth, "who played lacrosse as recently as 2014 at Princeton."
00:29:41
So look at that, good job.
00:29:42
- And good job to you, Dr.
00:29:44
Nikki.
00:29:45
Thank you so much for being with us to talk ignoble prizes and such.
00:29:49
Where can people find more of what you do?
00:29:52
- Yes, thank you for having me as always.
00:29:54
I'm findableonnicollackermans.com.
00:29:56
That's my website and a same handle on BlueSky.
00:30:00
If you wanna hear what ramblings I have to say on this fine day.
00:30:05
- Excellent.
00:30:06
Patrons, stick around for the extended show.
00:30:08
There are more ignoble winners we didn't talk about today.
00:30:12
And so we're gonna get to them on good day internet, bird guided missiles and breathing through your butt.
00:30:17
Stick around for a good sciencey laugh.
00:30:21
You can also catch the show live Monday through Friday, 4 p.m.
00:30:23
Eastern 2100 UTC.
00:30:24
Find out more at dailytechnewshow.com/live.
00:30:27
Back tomorrow with Brian Brushwood, who's going to explain how he uses AI in his daily life to do a lot including produces show.
00:30:36
Talk to you then.
00:30:36
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00:30:39
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00:30:42
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00:30:45
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