Jo: Hello, travelers. I’m Jo Frances Penn, and today I’m here with Bradley Chermside. Hi, Brad.

Brad: Hello.

Jo: Hello. So just a little introduction. Brad is an international best-selling author, copywriter, and multi-award-winning singer and entertainer. He’s the host of the El Camino de Santiago podcast, and today we’re talking about his book, The Only Way Is West: A Once-in-a-Lifetime 500-Mile Adventure Walking Spain’s Camino de Santiago. And on the video, Brad’s just showing the book there, it is fantastic. So we’re going to jump straight into it. I wanted to pick out this quote from the book.

You talk about, “A meaningless, empty existence, exacerbated by the Monday morning blues.” Why was pilgrimage the answer?

Take us back. What was life going on in your life at that time and why was pilgrimage your answer?

Brad: Well, exactly what you just described there was a meaningless existence. I knew it had a limit on it. I knew it wasn’t a sustainable way of living.

Jo: What was it though? We’re dying to know.

Brad: I don’t really need to go into details! but it was just doing what you do as a youngster. You’re experimenting with different things, and it wasn’t really fulfilling in any way. And the work I was doing at the time wasn’t fulfilling either, even though I was making a good living out of it. And I thought, you know what? There’s got to be a drastic change here, and I’d read two books about the Camino during the time. The Camino by Shirley MacLaine, which is mad.

I was like, “Whoa, I wouldn’t mind some of these crazy things happening.” These really vivid lucid dreams and hallucinations in her dreams and stuff. And also The Pilgrimage by Paulo Coelho, which is one of my favorites.

Jo: And I read that one. That was my one. Very different books.

Brad: Oh yeah, definitely. And again, a bit woo-woo, as they say.

But I’m into woo-woo so it was definitely preaching to the converted. And I thought, you know what? And anyway, I bumped into a friend of mine in London, just by chance, a serendipitous event, and they said to me, “You should… I’ve been trying to get in contact with you. You should walk the Camino.”

And this person was never ever present on social media, literally disappeared off the earth. And I just bumped into them on the wrong train on the London Underground. So I got onto the wrong train on the London Underground and I was like, “This is a sign.”

I decided to go and walk it, and the massive change was exactly what I needed.

It was a chance to look back at the life I was leaving and realize that it was going down a dead end and that changes were needed.

Jo: So what year was this?

Brad: This would have been 2015.

Jo: Oh, okay. So as we speak now, like a decade ago. And so, how old were you approximately at the time?

Brad: 2015, so going back I would’ve been 36.

Jo: That’s really interesting. So I do think that in that mid-30s, I also at that point, I was working as a business consultant, and I was like, “What is the point?” And I wasn’t living quite the high life that it sounds like you were, but it was also a similar, “What am I doing with my life?” I think there’s probably something that starts to hit at mid-30s when that happens.

Brad: Yeah, I think it comes at different points for everybody, doesn’t it? But you just know, like, you’ve got to make a big decision. And it was very, very necessary.

Jo: So you read those two books, but you… as far as I know, you’re not a Christian, right?

Brad: No, no, I’m not, no.

Jo: So how did you go from… I mean, obviously you read those two books, but something was drawing you, and you said you’re a fan of woo-woo.

What in your background prompted you to want to go on what is essentially a Catholic pilgrimage to change your life?

Like, you could’ve gone to India and done meditation or something, but you chose this.

Brad: Yeah, it’s a very good question because I have done stuff like that. I’ve spent time with Hare Krishnas. I’ve chanted with them and stayed in a Buddhist silent retreat, which for me is a really big challenge. The silent retreat was in Hertfordshire in the UK.

And I’ve always been spiritually curious. I’ve also worked in a church, worked for a church. You know, this was part of my journey, like, where is my spiritual destination? Where’s my spiritual home? Still haven’t found it, if I’m being honest. But that is all part of the journey so I’m always open to religion, always open to spirituality. And I just knew that this was a place where it was a kind of a bastion of European spirituality.

And my brother is super spiritual. He’s older than me but he’s super spiritual and he’s been an influence definitely. He’s a Christian, actually.

Jo: Okay, so there was something there.

Brad: Yeah, yeah. And he was shoving Bibles under my nose as a kid, and I’d pick it up. It never really resonated with me personally. But always aware, always open, always, and I knew this was just a place where I’d probably meet like-minded seekers.

Jo: Yeah, and I use that word too, seekers.

Brad: Mm-hmm.

Jo: And I think that’s, I guess, what I’d say to people listening, if you’re not religious, you can still be a seeker, like a spiritual person.

Which Camino route did you walk at that time and what were the most beautiful parts, the highlights?

Brad: The Camino Francés, which is the kind of official starting point, is in France at the foot of the Pyrenees, Saint-Jean Pied de Port. And you cross the Pyrenees, then you walk all the way to Santiago de Compostela across the whole of northern Spain.

I went on to the Atlantic and finished in Finisterra, which is the supposed end of the Earth until the Americas were discovered. So I love that idea. And that’s where the Camino Francés trail, the official trail, goes from. You can jump on and off any point along that trail. There’s not like a gate that opens up and closes until you get to the end. You could just get on there and walk it. And the first day is stunning. It’s a really tough walk. It’s u