We often hear people in our world say that they’ve spent their day “putting out fires.” Yeah? Well, we thought, why not talk to someone who has spent his career putting out actual fires—and who leads one of the most dynamic fire departments in the United States?

In this episode of The Better Way?, Zach and Hui sit down with Sheldon Hao, Chief of the Honolulu Fire Department, for a conversation about leadership and decision-making on the front lines of emergency response. Drawing from decades of service, Chief Hao offers a behind-the-scenes look at how firefighters make split-second decisions; train for the unexpected; and shape a culture rooted in family, service, and resilience. From managing emergencies in real time to using data for long-term strategic planning, Chief Hao’s insights are as applicable in business as they are in the firehouse.