If you’ve ever cuddled your dog while cutting meat in the kitchen, this episode is for you.

In this conversation on Sustainable Tea with Shreya,India’s biggest sustainability podcast, social psychologist and author Dr. Melanie Joy helps @shreyaghodawat breaks down the belief system that shapes our perception of animals: carnism, the invisible ideology that conditions us to eat certain animals while loving others.

From her personal journey, started by a health crisis and a childhood dog, to her research into the psychology of empathy, denial, and systemic violence, Dr. Joy reveals how conditioned our food choices are. 

She explains why people get defensive during conversations about animal suffering, why natural is used as a moral shield, and how even the most compassionate people support systems of harm.

The episode unpacks:

• The psychology behind why we love dogs but eat pigs
  

• How carnism uses defense mechanisms like objectification and de-individualization
  

• Why graphic content doesn’t always work, and how to be an emotionally sustainable activist
  

• The 3 Ns of justification: “normal, natural, necessary”
  

• What relational literacy means, and how it can heal not just our diets, but our dialogue
  

We also explore the intersection of animal exploitation, environmental destruction, and social injustice, highlighting how the same dynamics of domination drive racism, patriarchy, and speciesism.

This episode is both a wake-up call and a toolkit, for pet parents, animal lovers, and anyone curious about aligning their values with their actions.

In this Episode

0:00 - Introduction to Dr.Melanie Joy and her work

1:14 - Journey into Veganism and Sustainability

6:44 - Understanding Carnism; The Invisible Belief System

11:04 - Psychological Defense Mechanism in Carnism

17:42 The Interconnection of Animal Rights

22:07 Building Relational Literacy for a Better World

28:36 Overcoming infighting in Advocacy Movements

33:06 Navigating Emotional Responses in Advocacy

34:34 Creating Safe Spaces for Communication

36:55 The Power of Personal Storytelling

39:27 Self-Care in Advocacy

41:57 Understanding and Managing Trauma

44:24 Debunking Myths of Justification

46:17 Cultural Perspectives on Animal Consumption

48:19 Bridging the Gap in Food Choices

51:35 The Truth Behind Ethical Labels

53:34 Veganism and Indian Values

57:22 Rapid Fire Insights on Veganism

1:00:23 Building a Kinder World Through Compassion

1:03:20 Steps Towards a Sustainable Future