🌟 Master Your Next Move in Divorce: Watch our FREE Masterclass and learn how to empower your divorce journey with confidence, clarity, and control.

🎥 FREE MASTERCLASS: Get Instant Access

TRANSCRIPT:

Rhonda: Welcome to this episode of Divorce Conversations for Women. I'm your host, Rhonda Noordyk. There's one common thread facing everyone that's contemplating divorce or even in the midst of divorce, and that is, you don't know what you don't know, right? So I want to make sure to ask the tough questions so that you can get the answers that you need.

In today's episode, we're going to dive into the topic of negotiation for women. This episode is sponsored by Courageous Contemplation, our online course. So, if you're contemplating divorce, I want you to check out womensfinancialwellnesscenter.com/events.

I am so excited today. I am joined with Nicole Martin and John Tinghitella. To learn more about Nicole and John, we've linked their website and additional information in the show notes. You can also check out their website at www.nofearnegotiation.com. I want to get started here today. I am so excited that you guys are here because I feel like this is a topic that definitely deserves to have its own podcast episode. So, I'm a woman facing divorce, right? What's the one thing that we want the women that are listening to know about negotiating?

Nicole: It's so interesting, Rhonda, because I think that if you think of it with that directness of the question, the one thing I would say to a woman that's really thinking about negotiation is first the fact that it's a two-way discussion or conversation or exchange, and that they are worthy no matter what they are feeling or how they're feeling as they approach that table, that they are worthy equal in that conversation. And the question is, do they feel equal, first of all? Are they prepared in that conversation when they come forth? And are they also ready to listen? Because like I said, it's a two-way exchange. That's probably the first thing I would say. I don't know, John, what would you say?

John: I think that's a really good starting point. I think the power to listen is crucial to any successful negotiation. But to back up even another step, negotiation is just another word for managing relationships. Negotiation tends to have a negative connotation in a lot of people's minds, which creates resistance, which creates people not wanting to do it, which usually means they end up with a bad result because they kind of faded out when they should have leaned in. But that said, the ability to listen upfront is absolutely crucial. There's also a realistic connotation to negotiation that needs to be addressed and managed. It's the fact that negotiations, by their nature, are highly competitive, and we have to be careful in a negotiation to realize there's a clear winner and loser. This is not a ballgame with a time clock and a score at the end. This is people managing their lives going forward, and everyone has to leave, not so much with a victory, but everyone has to leave with what matters to them. And Rhonda, in your discipline of managing women through the extremely difficult dynamic of divorce, they tend to be highly competitive, highly adversarial, and a lot of times there are winners and losers, and that's just not healthy. It's a horrible outcome and our goal is to have positive outcomes.

Rhonda: And so I agree, and I love the perspective of it being built on relationships. I've got a client right now who is ... her attorney is a guy, then there's her husband and his attorney is a guy. And she's at the table feeling like nobody's listening to her. And so, the preparation part, I think, is super important, number one. And so I've been working behind the scenes with her to help prepare her to have some of those conversations. I think, Nicole, you mentioned the worthiness. Man, that is probably one of the most challenging pieces as women are going through divorce, their confidence has been shattered. Can we talk about the worthy piece? Do you have any suggestions or tips as they're going into this? And I don't like the whole fake it 'til you make it thing, but I think ... Are there some specific things that women could be doing to build up, like, I'm worthy to have this conversation, and what I have to say is important?

Nicole: Well, and we actually kind of put forth three letters with what we do with our process within negotiation specifically, No Fear Negotiation. And the first letter is M, and M really stands for changing your mindset. And I think for women, especially going through relationships, I can recall a particular instance for myself personally where almost every relationship that I'd had where it had come to an end and I was leaving, my counterpart in that relationship had actually driven me to a place of guilt where you're feeling like you weren't working hard enough or you didn't do enough or you need ... this is your fault that you're letting go and you're the quitter or something to that effect. And I would say that the strength that you derive as a woman through that exchange knowing that you're not to be made to feel less than and that you have tried, and feeling justified in the fact that maybe you've tried and you've come to this decision, because surely for a woman, by the time she's had that conversation, she's thought about it probably for months, if not years prior. So, she's already separated herself from it, but she can be drawn back in or even worse, just emotionally brought down.

Nicole:  And I would say for a woman that's coming into that exchange, it's really important from a worthiness perspective to honor your internal voice and what you know is right for you. And knowing and having faith that you're a child of God and that that other individual is special and a child of God as are you, and it's your responsibility to speak truth, and it's your responsibility to walk in your truth. And when you're walking in your truth and you speak from a place of love, not anger, not rage, but love, where probably ... and hopefully something started, you can still love somebody and not be in love with them. And if you can bring yourself back to that place of love for that other person, then you can hopefully look in the mirror and say, but more importantly, I love me and I know this is important for me, and for what reasons. And find a mantra that reinvests that voice in yourself so that you stay strong. Whether that'd be for you, if you can't do it for yourself, do it for children if you have children in your relationship. Do it for something outside of you that makes you strong. But you must get to the place where it comes from within.

Nicole: And sometimes, if you've been deceived or betrayed or you feel wronged, it's really important to talk to somebody else. And I think therapy is a great thing. I think getting a resource, somebody to talk out loud to help you reinforce you until you can reinforce yourself is, I think, critically important.

Rhonda: Huge. That's huge. That is really huge. And I think spot-on, right, to all of the things that you're saying, because I do think that most of the challenge when it comes to having these types of conversations and negotiating is a lot of that is our self-talk, right, and how we're showing up for the meetings. As I've been working with women, there was one girl in particular that comes to mind. I mean, she has just been full of guilt and feels super bad about her situation. And I mean pretty much couldn't talk about it without, I mean, doing the ugly cry. And we finally got her to a point where she could show up for the meetings, and still, there's some emotion, but it wasn't like that level of not being able to really clearly think through certain aspects of it. And she's a smart woman who has a lot to offer, but she needed to be able to show up in those meetings in that way. And I know that for her, that was a really big win. I felt like I could contribute.

Rhonda: Now, the challenge with that is when the other person or people in the meetings aren't used to that particular individual having a voice. There now becomes a level of ... a little bit of a ... it seems to be a little bit of a power struggle in those situations because they're used to being able to just dominate the conversation, and now she wants to be part of the conversation. She's got some good points to bring up, and so it's a whole new level of listening and hearing that is required on the other side as well.

Nicole: Right. We have to remember we can only control ourselves. And so, I see, more a woman who is at that table and she's maybe finding her voice and her inner strength. It's important to come, like I said, from a place of love because not everybody grows at the same pace. And so sometimes if you have a man across the table from you who you at some point in time loved and hopefully can still love, then you're coming to a